Jon Tenney Creates His Next TV Hit

0:02Speaker 1:This is Alec Baldwin and you're listening to Here's the Thing from iHeart Radio My guest today is a Juilliard trained actor whose work spans film, television, and the stage. For seven seasons, John Tenny played FBI agent Fritz Howard on the hit TNT drama The Closer, a role he would reprise on its spin off, Major Crimes. His television credits also include Scandal, True Detective, The Sex and the City Reboot and Just Like That and The Lincoln Lawyer.

0:38Speaker 1:His film appearances include Rabbit Hole, The Seagull, and I See You. A much respected stage actor, Tenny has performed works by acclaimed playwrights like Tom Stopperd and David Mammot on Broadway. This year, John Tenny stars in the new MGM Plus series American Classic, alongside Kevin Klein and his former Juilliard classmate Laura Lenny. With such an impressive cast, I assumed this was an easy show to green light. I was curious how Tenny first got involved with American Classic.

1:14Speaker 2:Well, actually, American Classic was an idea that my wife and I had been developing for years. Like we actually, I mean so we You called yourself so when Kevin said I'm in. That was when it happened, because this was back in twenty eighteen. I'm doing a play at Lincoln Center, doing this stop and play the Hard Problem, and we go it. Afterwards, we go out to see a friend of ours doing a play down at the Lucille Alerts Ellen New York and Dana Delaney, and she does this amazing play called Collective Rage. But we go see it, and we go out afterwards and we run into some friends, some writer friends, Tom Fontana and John Marcus, two terrific television riders. We all go out, we're talking after the show, and they're telling talking about a project working on in different a television series. And then my wife's goes, well, you know, I have an idea for a television series. And I'm like, what's that. You didn't tell me that, because we've been looking for something to work together. We've done a film together.

2:11Speaker 1:But your wife had told youion she didn't.

2:16Speaker 2:She didn't. She goes, you know, we shout having this conversation. She goes, imagine Kevin Klein. That's how she starts it. And she pitches the bare bones this idea, and the two friends Tom and John go you know, that's a really good idea. And after that conversation, Leslie was saying, oh, well, you know, if these professional writers think it's a good idea, maybe we should do this. So that was like the genesis of the idea and we began developing this project soon after that. Michael Hoffman, who Leslie's worked with before they did a film call that they did it with Kevin, they did The Midsummer Night's Dream, calls up. He's living in London. He goes, what's going on? You know, I've got can't got to get something going on. What's happened?

2:53Speaker 2:She goes, well, I have this idea. He's like, I love this idea. Let's go with Kevin would love this idea too, Let's do this. And then we knew this show Slings and Arrows. Bob Martin created this beautiful show, Slings and Arrows, a Canadian show, and we said we loved the voice of that. And so she goes, well, Michael, you know, do you know Bob Martin? Well, we know, I don't know them. Anyway, we put that those two together, they got along and everybody kept on saying yes to the project, and then Kevin we pitched to Kevin, and you know, Kevin had known Leslie and he known Michael.

3:25Speaker 2:We never worked together, but we both went to acting. It's the same acting school we went to Juilliard, so we knew we actually had similar like professors and stuff. Back in the day, we all went out to dinner and he said, I'm in. This is great and so that's how it all. And then we hit like serious hurdles. I mean we had you know, we had pandemic, we had strikes, we had studios leaving, a new studio coming in. I mean, crazy hurdles. But it was like this little engine that could that kept on going. So which is kind of, you know, kind of part of what we talk about in the show itself, this sort of uh collective of people come together to put you know, make something.

4:03Speaker 2:So there was something sort of meta about it in a way.

4:06Speaker 1:I watched the show not just because of Kevin. I mean I love Kevin, I love everybody on the show. I love Laura and Len. And so for Len, god, what a character he was. Oh my god.

4:15Speaker 2:Yeah, he saved the day, you know, because he came in right. We had been developing, like I say, for a number of years and having some table reads working on the script, and it had always been Harris Eulen.

4:24Speaker 1:The late late I just booked to christ today.

4:27Speaker 2:Oh you did that is memorial? Oh my god. I love that man. And and Laura goes way back with him obviously, and know we were we had started filming, we just started filming. In fact, the day, our first day of shooting, we got a call, Hey, Harris is in the hospital. And that was the beginning of the end of that. And and so that was and I actually if you notice the first episode is dedicated to him at the end of it. If you look really carefully in the in the second episode, Kevin and I are drinking some bourbon on the getting drunk on the stoop at the end night. And if you look at the label, it's you reserved and it's got a picture of Harris on it. And we toasted up there, just a little nod, you know. Yeah, but it Selene came in and just you know, at the eleventh hour. But he's extraordinary, extraordinary.

5:15Speaker 1:Well, the Harris my neighbor in on Long Island, and he and I did a couple of things together, little programs. We did a he would do celebrity autobiography, We did the stage readings of plays. Everybody out there worshiped Harists. They just thought he was he was it. You know that that brings to mind, you know the people we worked with that we really really learned something from. We're just admired. Like you're there on a set with someone in and going, I can't believe I'm doing something with this person. Is Kevin one of those people? For you?

5:43Speaker 1:It was a dream to work you never worked.

5:45Speaker 2:With him before that, never worked with him before, but you know, I grew up. I mean he was like a pinnacle for me. And it was like I remember I remember reading I'm a kid. I'm reading this article spread on him in the Times. I guess. He just come out in Sophie's Choice, which was I think his first film, you know, like making that Way, and there was a big shot of him leaning out from the Brooklyn Bridge, leaning out and was talking about this new generation of actors that are like trained and physical, and and I was like, well, that's that's the pinnacle. That's I mean, he's got it all, you know. So I've admired his work like yeah, for years and years and years.

6:18Speaker 1:He came and did my podcast down in Red Bank, New Jersey at the Two Rivers Theater. Comestey and John Diaz run Or were running Two River Theater down at Red Bank, and I said, let's do my podcast down there, and Kevin said yes and drove down in a town car just that night and did the thing and drove right back. And it's funny how people like that who you admire so much, like he turned me, he goes, He goes, I really enjoyed doing this with you, and he goes, we should do something together. And like I was like, you know, I was like, like I hit a cocaine, you know what I mean, we should do something together. I'm like, you probably see that. Everybody told you.

6:50Speaker 2:Well, you know, we had been talking about this with him, and we all went out to uh we came into New York from Los Angeles, and we all went to dinner at Orso's, you know, and we're sitting there and having to have a and at the end of it, he kind of gets up and he goes, yeah, yeah, we could be brothers. And I was like, my brother, my brother.

7:07Speaker 1:Now he went to Juilliard.

7:08Speaker 2:You went to Julian I was in the first class at Juilliard. Yeah, and then I went after vas after Vassia, I graduated. I graduated Vassar. And why did you think you needed more acting training? Well, you know, I was. I went there for my I did a very practical major in drama and philosophy advance I forgot. I always fall back on that philosophy. So look, I wanted to be an actor since you know, the third grade play was one of those things you did. Yeah, yeah, since I was a kid. Everybody kept on saying I'd grow out of it, and I was like, no, no, no, I never did. But I wanted the training. I wanted that conservatory training. I wanted to go to college. I wanted to have a liberal arts education and then but I wanted the sort of conservatory training. So that's why I went.

7:45Speaker 1:To Julia were there.

7:48Speaker 2:I was there for a year and then I left, and then I came back, and then I left again. I did two years and two different classes have masters. Well they not. You get a certificate. You get a certificate, you know, and saying.

8:01Speaker 1:Your name is Rockefeller, it says ends there.

8:03Speaker 2:Yeah, what did Juliet?

8:04Speaker 3:Right?

8:05Speaker 2:It's over. But you know the second class I was in. There was Laura, Laura Lenny so we you know, we've known each other since we were like in our early twenties, so when she agreed to do this, that was just like old home. You know. We we've done plays together at school and then outside of school, we've done some stuff in New York and we did a film together. But that was like a reunion. And there was a list of actress that Kevin really wanted to work with to play Kristen and the show. And that's Laura, that's Laura.

8:33Speaker 2:That's Laura's his ex, his ex love. Yeah, and I got a.

8:37Speaker 1:Big spoiler alert, what's coming about the Supergrass Okay, but that ending of that show was what fucking insane. I'm so well done.

8:44Speaker 2:I'm so I'm so glad you're.

8:46Speaker 1:Talking about it and they're both talking about the other it. Yeah, it sounds like you're both talking. I'm watching it going this is I'm crying laughing. Oh good, it was really clever. Oh good, well done. That's Shakespeare and it's intelligence. Well that makes that's made me really good episode.

9:04Speaker 2:It was Michael Hoffman and Bob Martin did episode eight. The two of them did that together. Ellen Ferry is another one of our writers. We had three writers.

9:12Speaker 1:It was how many shows did you do?

9:13Speaker 2:Eight episodes? Eight episodes?

9:16Speaker 1:Is it coming back?

9:17Speaker 2:And uh, well, we we wanted to come back. We haven't heard a word yet, but we you know, I think we're gonna know sometime before like midsummer, by end of summer. We should know something.

9:27Speaker 1:When I watch something like I have things I watch to comfort me when I'm really not feeling my best. The thing that medicates me is old episodes of Alfred Hitchcock Presents. That's very comfortable. Outer limits, twyl I need give me Rod Serling talking to something from my childhood. And every now and then I want some that's pure and clean and and and decent. And your show is pure and clean and decent and clever.

9:54Speaker 2:Well that's really that means set a goal. Well, it was a goal, you know, we really wanted to. We set it in the world of community theater and the theater, and you know, I think it's been sold that way a little bit, but I think the show is really about a lot more than just that. You know, It's about family and community and and and the importance of coming together to create something of value. And and and empathy, and so we wanted to touch on all those elements and it was kind of a needle to thread, you know that, you know, how do we We want it to be funny and entertaining and I'm glad you found it clever and all that, but you know, I find it really poignant in a lot of areas. And you know, we end up doing this production of our town and like the perfect player circumstances, Yes, exactly, that's a long way to get there.

10:44Speaker 1:Ony of me missing was the building burning down?

10:46Speaker 2:Oh yeah, well in that sort of mirror, do you believe me? It was a miracle. The whole production happened because we were, like I say, we've been pushing this up the hill for a long time. But it's nice to hear you say that you responded that way, because yes, we definitely wanted it to be. I feel proud of the show. I feel proud of the company, and I really feel good about, you know, putting a story like this out into the world at this time. You know, I don't know, the older I get it's like, what do you want to spend your energy is doing? And we're proud of putting this story out there right now, if you go to a.

11:16Speaker 1:Movie, and I want to ask you this as a father and as a filmmaker and a producer, if you watch an act of violence, that it inspires violence and there's something wrong with you. You know, if you watch adult content sexually speaking, then sex is something you ought to be doing. There's nothing wrong with that. So if you watch something that's very sexual, that concerns me too, but not in the same way that violence in films and TV shows concerns me. Now and now it's just like so much blood and so far.

11:42Speaker 2:Yeah, this is trauma TV they call it, right, is that what they?

11:45Speaker 1:I don't know.

11:45Speaker 2:I mean, yeah, I've heard that expression out there, and it is it's like you get. I mean, the world can be traumatic enough. And and you know, I don't think the show is just pure escapism at all either. I Mean, you can sit back and you can laugh at it, but it's not there's some stuffy it's not pure escapeism.

12:00Speaker 1:When somebody on the show is actually the father of your child.

12:05Speaker 2:I know you to be that way, right. There's other messages to be found in there, other things to think about. If you, if you let yourself take the journey of the show.

12:16Speaker 1:I want to go back to one thing, which is what did you get from Juilliard when you went to Julia, What did you get from that?

12:20Speaker 2:Well, you know what what I appreciated about that was the rigor. You know, it was that sense of like I said, I'd always wanted to be an actor, but I took it very seriously. And you know, I was doing community theater as a young kid. And you know, I grew up in Princeton, New Jersey, and it was I didn't realize it until I left Princeton just how sort of lucky I was to grow there because the university. Now, my dad worked for the university.

12:42Speaker 1:What'd your dad do?

12:43Speaker 2:He was a research physicist. He was a nuclear physicist and he worked there's a fusion test reactor.

12:49Speaker 1:That's what some of the Manhattan Project was birth.

12:52Speaker 2:Well, yeah, the Institute for Advanced sh Einstein was at Prince absolutely an Oppenheimer and yeah, but he worked there's a Forest Hall campus. Is that he was involved in nuclear fusion, not fission, and they have a test reactor there. That's why we were in Princeton.

13:08Speaker 4:And uh and yeah, you know my dad a nuclear physics I know it sounds I'm not trying, but you know, when I went away to look at college, I was like, wait, not everything looks like Princeton.

13:19Speaker 1:It was.

13:20Speaker 2:It was What was great about it was what the university brought into the town. I mean, you know, we weren't old money Princeton or anything, but the university brought in this amazing theater, amazing you know school. Oh yeah, music, dance, all this culture because of the university. And so I was exposed to that at a really young age and just loved it. So to come back around why I wanted to go to a place like Juilliard lucky enough to get in there was that, you know, it was a real conservatory.

13:52Speaker 1:Describe for people who don't know what is a conservatory, Well, I.

13:55Speaker 2:You you go there and you study voice, you study dance, you study movie, when you study steam study it's very very focused.

14:03Speaker 3:You know.

14:03Speaker 2:When I got out of high school, I knew I wanted to be an actor, but I also wanted to go to college and study like say, philosophy or history or something like that. You know, I grew up. Education was valued in my family that I grew up. I got older brothers and sisters and I'm the youngest four two older brothers and an older sister. It was one two three, then dot dot dot me. So I was like, you know, id so of course I became the actor, right, and I need to find my guy. I had to have my say at the dinner table, right, So I'll show you. But I remember I was like, what do I want to do? I bett out of high school.

14:37Speaker 2:I know, this is what I want to do. Some people said, well, don't you just go in and start auditioning, and I said no, no, no, I want to go to college. And then I had the liberal arts education. But then I wanted that conservatory that that really working on my body, my voice, text analysis, all of that was an English well, I mean yes it was. There was a lot of technique there, which is something that's something I think you can go to school for. I mean there's a lot of other things that you you I don't think you necessarily have to go to school for, but such as some of the well look, imagination, yeah exactly, you know. I mean, every every actor comes at it.

15:12Speaker 2:I mean, look, you know, I mean we all everybody has their own way to add it, but we're all sort of after the truth in some way, and we just get to it in different ways.

15:20Speaker 1:Right, But my technique seven. Nothing happens to take seven technique or burned the first six.

15:34Speaker 2:It all comes together a little bit. At the time, I thought, you know what I want to go into that. I want to have that training. And so I went and then and then I left. And it's interesting because you know, I left because I got a job. You're not supposed to work while you're there, and I had been working. I had been you know, doing community I've done summer stock. I had this plan when I when I went to college, I said, I knew I want to be an actor. I want to be in the union.

15:58Speaker 2:So every summer I was a vasser. That's where I went to college. Every summer I went up to Williamstown Theater Festival to do plays. Yeah, and I started out as an apprentice, and I then went into the non equity company painting sets off and I was like, I'm gonna by the time I get out of here, I'm going to accrue enough points to be in the actor's equity. You know, That's what I wanted to Well, they kept on adding rungs to the equity ladder. So like I was like, this is not not happening, but.

16:24Speaker 1:Going to a DMV.

16:25Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean they're like you're not ready, right right right. So I sort of had this plan, and then I got out of college and I thought, well I still need you know, I'm not equity, but I wanted this conservatory training. But then I started getting jobs and working in the waiver. Well, well, actually, somebody I met at Williamstown while I was there a directing intern. I'd gotten into school, but the last summer I was at Williamstown, I had to make some money and so I said, well, let's run the company bar. And I ran into this directing intern, Melanie, and she had this big boom box and I was like, I need a box for the for the bar because we're this is this little basement where the company comes after the shows and we get to be friends. Smash cut. We're out of the Juilliard.

17:09Speaker 2:I go to I go to Juilliard. She goes to the city. She starts working at Simon and Cuman Casting, and I run into her to party in the city and she goes, what do you do you have a picture and resume. I'm working at the Simon. They're they're casting this national tour. Mike Nichols is cashing this national tour of the real thing. And do you have an agent? I don't have an agent, but I got a picture of resume. She we'll give me a picture and resume. I'll slip it into the thing. So this woman I met at Williamstown slips some of the thing in. I get a call back, I get them, blah blah blah.

17:37Speaker 2:Long story short, I get the gig.

17:38Speaker 1:You auditioned for him?

17:40Speaker 2:For him? Oh oh oh, I went oh. I was like, I was so fucking I didn't think I realized at the time. I was like, I went to the bar the house, I walked into the wings. It was the first time I'd been in the wings of a Broadway house. That was like the final callback and Lincoln Center. No, no, that was it was what was the Broadway house we auditioned with they were doing. I think we might have been the booth you toured for how long? It was supposed to be a year? It was supposed to be a year. And I was at Juilliard and I got cast in this and I was like, listen, I gotta go.

18:08Speaker 2:I got the job, and they were it was Brian Bedford was the lead in the in the tour National Tour, and he had taught at Juilliard back in the day, and so they sort of thought, okay, it's Mike Nichols, it's this. They sort of gave me a leave of absence. Basically, they said you can go for a year, which you were probably like the thirtieth year. And people go to that school then they're getting jobs. They're like, okay, come back later. So I got that, I went out and that was that tour was produced by Emanny Aisenberg. You remember many Iron Mountain Productions producing all the Neil Simon shows on Broadway at the time. And the tour ended before a year and ended after eight months, and I came back. I was all of a sudden, it was summer in the city. He goes, hey, man, we got all these young kids in these Neil Simon shows, Biloxi Blues, Brighton Beach. Aisenberg, you want to come in and be an understudy here and do that. So all of a sudden I started working. I had this Broadway gig. I was understudying on Broadway, and so I stayed out Juliard.

19:02Speaker 2:I didn't go back. I did that for a couple for a year, and then I thought, you know, I missed. I kept on feeling like I need to. I I kind of want to go back, and I want to I want to do the class work. And I so I.

19:15Speaker 1:Won't know why, Well, weren't you getting from working with Mike Nichols that you well, no, I know, you know, it's where you're not getting from your national tour of stop art.

19:24Speaker 2:I don't know if I made I don't know. Maybe it's crazy how I was thinking. There was some part of me that felt like I needed you need to train, you need to study, you need to train your voice. You trained when you're young. Yeah, you need to go back to that. I that was sort of in my head. And and then I went back and I was there for a year and I got cast in another thing, and uh, and I left. But you know, when I left the second time, one of my professors, because you know, when I went to Juilliard, it's changed much a lot of over the years. When I was there, it was a real sort of break you down to build the up kind of school, which I don't really agree with.

20:02Speaker 2:That respond to I don't know. I mean the rigor, yes, but like the we got to smash it down to build you up is not I don't I don't think that's the best way to do it. But when I left the second time, one of the professors pulled me aside and he kind of wanted to put a little earworm in me, just to like stick it to me. He goes. He goes, you will always feel like you could have been better. You will always feel like you could have been Like he's just like a like a little curse ever going to get it. And I thought, yeah, yeah, and yeah, and man, to this day and I have to say, you know you coming back to Kevin Kleine, I shared that story with him actually when we were working on the thing, and he's like, hey, John, I was only there for a year. He was in the first he was there, you know, the first class. He's like, I was only there for two years. Like don't you know he don't. He kind of just tried to help me let that go, because I to this day, like, you have these little things that stick with you.

21:01Speaker 1:You wanted more, you wanted more school, you wanted more training after you had you know, now when you work with something. I worked with Mike. I did my first one of my first parts in the movie was Working Girl with Mike, and I thought Mike was just hysterically funny because we take him in there and he was just everything was right to the marrow. He just told you we didn't have time, you know, just cleave right to the marrow. And he'd say to me, he goes.

21:20Speaker 1:I mean, he would always be very polite and say to me, he goes, how do you see this? He was very kind to me. He was so kind to me, and he goes. Because we were going to do the movie Working Girl were Mellie and I were the leads. And I think I've had like two or three other directors say the same thing, So I think this is a thing that directors say just to enlist you in their cause and make you feel secure. Mike says to me, I wanted you to do play the two leads, and they told me if I had you with the leads, they were going to give me thirty million dollars, but if I had Harrison and Sigourney, they were going to give me sixty five million dollars to make the movie.

21:51Speaker 1:And I've been, oh, well, I get it. I understand, I understand. I had other directors said now I want one famous one. I won't tell you. He said, Now if I do it with you, they're gonna get gonna me thirty million, But I would do with these other two. They're gonna give me seventy five million. I was like, well, I understand, yes, of course, and what is this the thing directors say, like to get you to play the other role. But he comes up to me and he goes, how do you see this scene? And I go, well, I thought maybe i'd be playing around and I'm having sex with this girl and she go to see her head slide down, slide down, and just see me smiling, and he goes, He goes, Okay, he goes, that's not a bad idea. You know, we say that that's not a bad idea. And he says, but what I thought was, you know, she opens the door and there she is naked right on top of you, riding you for all it's worth. And I go okay, okay, And the two of us had to be like, you know, all our clothes off, boom boom, boom, boom boom, and Michael was amazing.

22:39Speaker 1:But Mike then he said to me, one this is my favorite Mike. Mike issays to me, he goes, I want you to do another movie with me, and then he calls me up and I'm in my old apartment. I was just breaking up with my girlfriend and we've been breaking up for like a year, and it was really like the one of those shitty relationships that way, and we just can't seem to euthanize this thing. Mike calls me and he goes, I would like you to do it's January. It's right after the Hall. He goes, I have this part for you in this movie. And I said, well, I said, I don't think I can go to work right now. I'm really like so depressed and I'm bringing up with my girlfriend and my life is hell, and my mom's been sick and you know my mom at Breast Catcher she beat it, but everything was not great and he and he goes, we're not shooting the movie until May. This is January, and I go, well, I mean, I can't tell you how, you know, I don't know what's going to happen. How he goes, what problems could you possibly have that couldn't be solved by May.

23:25Speaker 1:He said, I what a thing to say. He got me there, Mike, he got me there. But but did he help he was it director or was it just casting? He just turned you loose?

23:35Speaker 2:Oh no, no, he completely Wait what was great? Yeah, he really helped me. Yeah. I mean it's just watching him to do the whole thing and working with Stoppard, I mean, the two of them, it was. It was an extraordinary Stopp'd like his pieces.

23:46Speaker 1:Are so dry.

23:47Speaker 2:A Stoppered is a rock star. He was a rock star, the smartest guy, could talk about anything, anything, and you know, a genius and always choosing the right word, always just the right way to say it. Butcess completely accessible. Not I'll stand off at all. Yeah. Actually, I just you know, I got my equity card with Mike doing Stoppard and then I just The last thing I did in New York was this Stoppard. My hard probably was about It was a play that was done in London with the New York premiere was in twenty eighteen at Lincoln Center.

24:18Speaker 2:I played the father of a girl who was adopted. It's about a group of scientists, young student scientists who and the lead girl had been adopted by you, yes, as a child, and that's revealed at the end of it.

24:35Speaker 1:But I first found him really tough to you know, it's very heady and very very.

24:40Speaker 2:It is very heady. I mean he was working actually on Leopoldstadt at the time, which is that this masterpiece that the last play he did, which was really his personal story about you know, d deeply personal story that I think that was the last play he'd written that before he died. But it was a it was a very heady thing to come into with Mike Nickels and Tom Stopper to sort my that. But Mike was incredibly helpful to me, very kind, although you know, he would also do things like we're in tech rehearsals and run through before we open, and he he comes and he puts his arm around me and he starts walking me across the stage. He doesn't say anything. He's going he's walking me across the stage. He's like he's going to say something important. He doesn't say anything, walks a little farther, doesn't say anything. Well, falks little far, doesn't say anything.

25:27Speaker 2:Finally we get to the other side of the stage. He goes faster, gotcha, okay, understood. I remember the little funny story. We opened in Palm Beach. That's where the tour started in Palm Beach. Stoppard in Palm Beach. Yeah, well it's it was the circuit, you know, it was Palm Beach, it was Fort Lauderdale, San Antonio. There's a whole Yeah, well, no, the whole Shubert. Yeah, and he's going on to me. So I'm gonna take everything back to dinner. And there's this great restaurant there. They got the best key lime pie. This is a key line high.

26:01Speaker 2:He goes on and on about this key limp pie. You gotta get the key linpie. I gotta get. As we go, we have this amazing meal, you know, appetizers, this this Entre's whole thing finally gets to be deserved. We've got He's got the whole company there, and he's like, now we'd like key lampie for everybody. Waiter comes back, he goes, we're all at a key lim pie. We have no key line pie. Next day we go to this to the stage. We walk into the theater for Tech and lined up across the proceeding from one end to the other, one of these boxes of key lin pie that he tracked down and he was like, everybody gets there.

26:30Speaker 1:He doesn't mess around.

26:31Speaker 2:Yeah, he doesn't mess around.

26:36Speaker 1:Actor John Tenney. If you enjoy conversations about the craft of acting, both on the stage and screen, check out my episode with Tenny's American Classic co star Kevin Klein.

26:49Speaker 3:Pacoola would say to me, look, whatever we've talked about in this scene, what we think it's about, or what you know, what could happen if you get a different impulse during that scene. Forget what plan you follow your impulses. The character was this psychopath and had to be unpredictable, and he wanted it to be as spontaneous as possible. And then again I was blessed with Merrill who Merrill said, don't be afraid you're gonna hurt me, because a lot of it was very physical. She said, you can't, which I took as a challenge, of course, but she was right, and Picola said, do what you want.

27:28Speaker 1:To hear more of my conversation with Kevin Klein, go to Here's the Thing dot org. After the break, John Tenny talks about working opposite Mary Louise Parker on stage and the irreplaceable feeling of the theater community. I'm Alec Baldwin and this is here's the thing. John Tenny played FBI agent Fritz Howard on The Closer for seven seasons. Tenny appeared in one hundred and nine episodes and impressively long run for a single series. The Closer was just one stretch of a career that has navigated seamlessly between television, film, and the stage. With so much of his recent work being on TV, I wanted to know when was the last time John Tenny acted in a film and if the medium still interested him.

28:25Speaker 2:Well, I did a little indie called Ice at the Bottom of the World that actually did that right after I wrapped, so recently, but yeah, recently, Yeah, do.

28:33Speaker 1:You find that films are still interest you? You don't have kids at home now? Your daughter's home?

28:36Speaker 2:Yeah, my daughter, she's twenty eight, she was. She lives in la but I think she's moving to New York in the fall, that's what she's saying. So just as soon as you got to play, ye would be very nice. Yeah, she's she's the best.

28:48Speaker 1:She's does TV. You feel like like for me, I feel like I've done that. I traveled, I broke my I unpacked the suitcase, repacked the suitcase. Shoot shoot, shoot shoot. Now I'm like, I really don't want to work that much anymore. Yeah, but did a TV show. I feel very comfortable with that. Yeah.

29:03Speaker 2:I mean, look, I think it depends on the project, it seems. I mean, if I hope we get to come back and keep on telling the story of American classic, I mean I would love that. And that was a real That was the first time I'd actually really developed something from the ground up. You know, with television. A lot of times with the TV series, like there's a train that's moving and you're like a gun for hire, and boom, you step on the train and it's going.

29:23Speaker 2:But there is something to be said about the community of television, especially if something goes on for a while. It's more like a play in a way. As far as you get a company as opposed to film. You know, you're very close for a second and you're gone, the travels staying yeah, yeah, no, I understand with all those kids. Absolutely no, of course, Well, you know, the closer was I stayed. The Closer was a godsend for me because you know, I had split with my ex, the mother of my daughter. I used to always go like I would come back to New York. I would do a play, a movie, or a TV show in LA to sort of support my theater.

29:58Speaker 1:Happened.

29:59Speaker 2:I come back to New York and I do a play, and I go back and make a little money in LA. Then I come back and do a play in New York.

30:04Speaker 1:And that was just the dream.

30:05Speaker 2:That was my life for years. And then when I split with my ex and I have this five and a half year little girl that's in LA, I had to cut off that whole New York life of me. I was like, no, I'm I'm raised, I'm raising I'm raising my daughter for in La for you know, because I got her half the time. So U and the Closer allowed me. They were such sweethearts. They allowed me to take my daughter school every morning, picked my daughter up. They you know, the role I played was you know, I was. I had all the love relationship, you know, I had you know, all everybody else ran around, did all the cop talk and all that sort of stuff, and then I got all the kitchen sinks, you know, meaty scenes that you want to do as an act.

30:46Speaker 2:You know, I didn't have any of the cops speak. I just we had the love scenes and the and the home drama, and you know, I adored Kira. But they worked around my schedule so I could help raise my daughter, which was and it ran for seven years.

31:00Speaker 1:It was like just we looked at at one hundred and nine episodes, one.

31:02Speaker 2:Hundred and nine episodes to just a God sent you know, a lifeline as far as that goes as a single dad for sure. And actually the head of TNT that's where the closer was, is a terrific guy, Michael Wright, who's now but now he's ahead of mgmus. We took this to Michael because he used to be an actor and when this project we were shopping it around, I was like, we got to bring it to this guy. He's gonna love this because he loves the theater. And sure enough he stepped up.

31:32Speaker 1:And then when the theater for me, the theater is something I still cling to.

31:37Speaker 2:Well, I'll tell you no, I've seen you on I mean what you get a stage performance? Said like, really was an amazing prelude to a kiss?

31:43Speaker 1:Oh god, you saw that.

31:44Speaker 2:Nineteen eighty nine, I'd just done a play with Mary Louise, What you doing down the Old Globe. I'd done a big Terrence McNally play that was supposed to come into town didn't end up coming into town, but we did it down to the Old Globe and it actually that that started my career at in Los Angeles. Actually, but she came in and said, you got to come see this play I'm doing in New York. And I went to see that, and that was an extraor that Craig Luke's play was just extra.

32:09Speaker 1:I tell you she knows this. When I did Streetcar, I'm Broadway, I'd go on stage. Amy Madigan would come to my room just for five minutes. It was fun and I just adored her. And Amy Maddick would come to my room. And the joke was she'd say, because I smoked then, and she'd say, not a lot, but I smoked pretty habitually. She come to my room, Amy, and she said, let's rehearse our smoking. Was the joke we'd say. So we both let up a cigarette and be like rehearsed. We said, well, you have to rehearse our smoking. So we did that. But when I did Prelude with Mary Louise, I went on stage, and I don't say this. I'm sixty eight years old now, I I think I have enough perspective to know what's really So.

32:42Speaker 1:I fell in love with Mary Louise Parker. Every night I walked down stage. I was so in love with her. I could not tell you how in love with her I was. I'm sure you probably felt the same.

32:51Speaker 2:Way one hundred percent, and that strange different. Oh yeah, she came in. She comes in sideways to the room like I remember meeting her and I was like, who is this girl? This was before shed, you know, taken off and I was like, who is this girl? What is the choices she makes? Just mesmerizing. But you know that I bring up that play because not only I mean, you were terrific in it, but it's it was so poignant and incredibly funny, and it reminds me a little bit actually of American classes in that sense. There's a poignancy to it.

33:22Speaker 1:There's things I want to do still work wise in the theater, I'm really kind of strong on. I mean, the last play I did on stage was twenty fifteen. I think I did all my Sons with Laurie Metcalf out on Long Island. Oh, we had a real shot at doing it on Broadway, and then Laurie had to go do her TV series.

33:40Speaker 2:There's nothing like that community to do. What real experience of the theater? Yeah, well yeah, especially with other kids. I get it, I get it, but I tell you there's something about that, a whole group of strangers being in a room and experiencing something that you get in the theater that is really helpful.

33:56Speaker 1:It's a part you want to play.

33:57Speaker 2:Well, you know, I would actually love to go back and revisit and revisit the real thing, only playing Henry. That would be an extraordinary thing to do. There's a bunch of parts that I've grown out of, but yeah, I mean that's that's the one that comes to mind.

34:09Speaker 1:Action. I mean for me, you find plays. I said to somebody, I just look at Williams. I say, well, you're going to be Chance, You're gonna be Brick, You're gonna be Stanley. Then there's that huge leap and then that's why you see every actor do Shannon. I just sad Tim Daily do Shannon. Last year. Everybody rolls out there iguana. Yeah, that's all there is until you play the doctor and Streetcar or Big Daddy if that's it, or Gooper and I have wanted to do a play, but the difficulty is the economics of Broadway now were tough too.

34:39Speaker 2:Well, the economics in theater don't make any sense. Yeah, they just don't. They don't.

34:43Speaker 1:I can only do that for profit. I just, I just I won't take the chance. I did Orphans on Broadway. This is the moment where we had Shia and he quit Shia Labuff and Ben came in and saved us. Ben Foster saved our lives parachuting in and learned all the loves and took this place. But we did that, and we got merciless reviews. They were like, you know, you have no idea what you're doing. You suck, you ps you suck. And but I really enjoyed that experience.

35:08Speaker 1:I mean was there were some big problems with the production obviously, but I really really enjoyed that experience. But I sat down with Bob Cole, Him and Solo were the producers, Fred and Cole, who I like very much of her smoker. He kind of took me through the economics of modern Broadway, the papering of the houses and however, thy Vinnie works, and it was like, God, this is a night I'm never coming.

35:31Speaker 2:Well, there's that great sequence with where Billy Carter plays Connor Boyle in our show talks about the economics of of his theater. Had like donuts pay, but theatre doesn't you know when he comes and has that whole speech where he talks about take your man, Stephen Sondheim. You know he's a genius. Only two of the shows recouped.

35:49Speaker 1:Who is that woman that played his wife, the crazy.

35:51Speaker 2:Elise Elise Kiddler?

35:53Speaker 1:Do me a favorite, Tell her how much I love She cracked me up.

35:59Speaker 2:She's amazing, She is amazing. She is the whole company we have.

36:03Speaker 1:And Kevin goes through all four ways you can say you have no talent, you have no talent. Finally, and she's like.

36:14Speaker 2:And then she breaks your heart in that scene, you know, like you're laughing at her, and then all of a sudden you see her hear that she doesn't have any talent. She's fabulous, she's crushed.

36:22Speaker 1:Tell those guys, Hoffmann, tell them I'm to save my hats off to them. Actor John Tenny, if you're enjoying this conversation, tell a friend and be sure to follow Here's the Thing on the iHeartRadio app, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. After the Break, John Tenny takes us behind the scenes of American Classic and its development process. I'm Alec Baldwin and this is Here's the Thing. Acting maybe John Tenny's first love, but it isn't the only role He's held on a set. During his years on The Closer and it's spinoff Major Crimes, Tenny directed several episodes himself well before taking on a producing role on American Classic. I wanted to know what Tenny's experience was like directing a television show after acting in it for so long.

37:28Speaker 2:I directed one of The Closers, and then they had did a spin off, Major Crimes, and I directed a bunch of those.

37:33Speaker 1:Did you enjoy that?

37:34Speaker 2:I did enjoy that. I mean again, it's like a New York get on a moving train. But I felt like it called on all parts of me in a way that look, I love acting, but he sort of is a very single focus. But directing it was a great. One of the directing mentors of mine said, you know what it is, It's like painting a big triptick, huge triptick, but from one inch away, and so you've got to concentrate on these little tiny things. But you got to keep all of this in mind. And I thought that was a great analogy, and so it was. It's exciting to sort of be called on, have all those parts you called on, And I felt a little bit that way actually, you know, producing, you know, being one of the producers on this show that was was the show America classic. It was so satisfying being just involved in being in the conversations.

38:18Speaker 1:Where did you shoot?

38:19Speaker 2:We shot in New Jersey. We're in New Jersey, Mapleo, New Jersey. Remember, Yeah, yeah, half hour from the city, all location. It was cheaper to shoot all on location then on stages. So no building.

38:30Speaker 1:Netflix is building that big well campus out there.

38:32Speaker 2:They're building a big Yeah.

38:35Speaker 1:But you like directing, I do. I do like that. I directed once and I hated every moment.

38:39Speaker 2:Really what you hate all?

38:40Speaker 1:Well, First of all, the story is a legend which I won't bore you with now. It's in bizarre because the producer committed bank fraud that's of his. In fact, two of his financiers went to prison. I contacted a family friend of mine, who was a teacher with my dad on Long Island for ten years. After he was like around thirty two, when he was still young enough, he took the test and joined the FBI in Manhattan, and he was friends with my dad. My dad passed away many years ago. He was very young. My dad was only fifty five when he died. But this guy, Danny, will just say his name. I called him on the phone.

39:13Speaker 1:He's in the FBI and Manhattan, and I called him and I go, here's what happened. He goes, Wow, you're kidding me. And they go ahead, and these guys broke Nevada banking laws and two of them went to prison for bank fraud. I mean what they did was they falsified the documents that collateralize the loan. So you go to the bank, which I mean obviously there's good. There's a few of the usual suspects out there, and the bankers roll there and we're all signing the loans. So they're going to get Imperial Bank, the famous bank that would lay out all the money back then, and Imperial gave us the money to make the movie, and those guys collateralized that with false document They didn't have any money in the bank. They but one of the guys was the producer. The other guy was a bank official from the Bank of New York who wrote false documents for his clients, saying, oh, he's got the five bill and he's good for it. And then we go and shoot the movie. And the producer comes up to me in the beginning of the shooting first week. He goes, I'll tell you what I'm going to do, because I'm gonna keep current on your acting because we bundled all

40:03Speaker 1:your money as a producer. He goes, but I'm gonna keep current on your acting payments, and i'm gonna keep current on your directing payments, and all your money's frontloaded as a producer because I'm not going to pay you a dime. I'm gonna pay you SAG minimum fix to com and you're welcome to come and direct the movie for free and finish the movie for free. This is week one, and he goes, or per the SAG contract, the first ad will come in and finish the movie, and I'll make you come and watch because you'll have to come and do this. My point is is that wh I directed a movie and the thing I hated most was dealing with actors.

40:33Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I know, it's yeah, getting.

40:35Speaker 1:Them to do what I wanted them to do. The lead actress turns to my friend. I'm talking to him, going to just throw it away, just just do this. When she says to you, just like you're you're a sales clerk and you don't really give a shit, and that. When the woman who shall remain names turns to me, he goes, oh, yes, she goes, Listen to Alec. He plays all the parts the best. He's great at everyone. He can play all the parts in the movie. She was like really pissed that I was saying to her, Hey, man, we got we got Tony Hopkins. I pay Tony Hopkins a million dollars for one week, so I got dan Ackword, Kim Katrell, Barry Miller, Barry Miller, Barry Millerary Miller.

41:07Speaker 2:First television shows I haven't did with Barry My Eagle, Justice, Thomas Carter with Equal Justice. Yeah, Joe Morton, I.

41:13Speaker 1:Love the taste. My girlfriend loves the teast. The communion Waifer's father. Now, Murphy Brown, you were Murphy Brown's love interests.

41:21Speaker 2:I was Murphy Brown's fifteen years younger than that was Murphy Brown's work. That was great. I was doing I can't I think I told you. I went out to do that play with Mary Louise at the Old Globe and then I stayed on to do Romeo and Juliet at the Old Globe. And I'm doing Romeo and Juliet the Old Globe and a review comes out in the La Times with my picture on it, and their second season, Murphy Brown's about to come up, and somebody in the casting sees his picture in the La Times and says, this guy we were trying to hire Miles older brother who comes in and has this little affair with Murphy Brown.

41:53Speaker 2:So because of the review of that, they call me in. I come up for a meeting and Mike Nichols, bless his heart, because he goes way back Candy Bergan. There's a little call saying, hey, Candy, because they were you know, I discovered John Tonny and so so that's how that all came about. But that was I remember. I was so excited to meet her and I get taken up to the stage and she's in the middle of the there she's rehearsing something. She's with a bunch of people and she's talking to the crew and she's telling this story and I'm just standing in the wings. I haven't met her yet. I'm waiting on the stage. And she's telling this story and she got all the crew and she's telling a story about when she was shooting some movie.

42:32Speaker 2:I don't know if it was eleven harrow House or something. She's talking a story about where she was squibbed up and she's running and she goes and I'm running and I'm running. I have all these squibs on and I'm running. I'm running and the squib starts sliding down, sliding down like this, and they're about to go off, and I'm like, stop, stop, stops kind of. He says, this is gonna look like I got shot in the I don't know what I can say on here right corpus Christie, right right, shot in the corpus Crisby. Yeah, And then she goes, Hi, I'm Candide, So.

43:04Speaker 1:Now what do you think about Like for me, it's changed so much, obviously, And I'm always haranguing and complaining about virtual casting. I said, you know, when I was younger, I said this numerous times on the show where I'd go see Jane Jenkins and Janet Herschinson. I'm with Jane and Janet and you walk out the door and they'd say, you know, the reason I had a career was they'd say, he's not right for Tom in this movie, but he's right for Bob and the other movie. They got eight plates in the air. At the same time, they're casting lots of things, and there are a whole lot of to us, we're going to put you in something. Yeah, we're gonna put you in. We like you, and we're gonna make this work.

43:34Speaker 2:Somehow, it's so much harder now to get in, you know, really much harder. I mean, Bernie tells he is our casting director cast the American classic. Yeah, Bernie, and he casts a lot of theater. He knows everybody. When they were auditioning for young actors to play my daughter in the show, what's her name? Oh nell nell ver Lack, Oh my god, nelver Lack just extray. So so Bernie gets these submissions, these tapes. He said, we got six thousand submissions for one part. Narrow it down to hundreds and hundreds, and they're all these self tapes, these kids alone in a room like with a with an AI reader or their own voice. You listen to some of these tapes, you go, oh, wait, they're reading with themselves.

44:18Speaker 2:They've recorded their voice doing the other lines, like just totally. And you know, we ended up, you know, having a whole rehearsal process and bringing in a bunch of people like mix and match with the actors who are auditioning, and all these kids would come in live in the room and they would be so thankful. They go like, I don't care if I get this job or not. It's so nice to be in a room with people and actually work with and see people live and and and and read stuff. Because these kids are just like trapped alone doing these self tapes. It's a it's a terrible, terrible situation in community that it was I feel about.

44:52Speaker 2:Then yeah, yeah, well let me just say that.

44:54Speaker 1:Then let me just say this, which is that I wanted you to do this show because you brought a real important thing to me to mind, and that is you've done everything. You've worked all the time for years. You've made a living as an actor for decades now. And what I love is I watched the show when I realize watching you and the whole group, but you in particularly, I watched and I go, you know, something wonderful is right around the corner. I always felt like when I was working in this business, I don't believe this, but I started to believe that. It's like I'm in that judge phase. I'm in the phil Bosco phase of my career. I have my tennis clothes on, I put the robe over my tennis clothes. I simply behide the bench and saying order the jury will disregard that comment from the prosecutor. You may proceed, And that's it. That's my one line for the day. They call lunch, I go to play tennis at the bubble, and I mean that's I'm in the judge phase of my career. And when I see you doing this show, I realized, you never know, there's something beautiful right around the corner. Even if you've been doing this for forty years, there still

45:47Speaker 1:might be some wonderful opportunity right there.

45:49Speaker 2:Absolutely absolutely, do you feel the way about the show, Well.

45:51Speaker 1:I do, you know.

45:52Speaker 2:I mean, there was a dark period before we did the show and was pushing up the hill, but you have to create it. You have to create your own opportunity. So I'm in this show caming back because we created our own opportunity, you know. And so there's a lesson there and if at least other things fantastic, but character neath a lawyer, Well, I'm gonna hold you to that.

46:10Speaker 1:No, no, not for your result. I just tell your hip with a lot of shit and you walk at it like god. You know what I mean.

46:16Speaker 2:Well, I'm really happy that the show resonated with you. We're really proud of it.

46:20Speaker 1:I'm really jealous. I really really envvi you. Let'say it's going to a great, great group of people.

46:24Speaker 3:Oh.

46:24Speaker 2:The same director for all the episode, Michael directed six out of the eight, and then Trisha Brock, another director, came and directed two of those. Yeah. I tell people, come spend some time in Millersburg and you won't regret it. You'll feel good.

46:39Speaker 1:My thanks to actor and director John Tenney. This episode was recorded at CDM Studios in New York City. We're produced by Kathleen Russo, Zach MacNeice, and Victoria de Martin. Our engineer is Isaac Kaplin Woolner. I'm Alec Baldwin. Here's the thing is brought to you by iHeart Radio