Podcast · Business

Change Signal: Modern Change Management that Works

by Michael Bungay Stanier | Modern Change Management Practitioner · English · Business

New episodes: Weekly
Typical length: 29 min
Latest: 7 Oct 2026
Language: English

Latest episode

7 Oct 2026 · 29 min

Your Change Pilot Should Probably Fail | Amy Edmondson | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation with Amy Edmondson: Are we learning — or just performing success? When should a change project be allowed to fail? And what are we afraid to say when the stakes get high? Amy Edmondson is best known for her work on psychological safety, and here she connects it directly to change leadership, experimentation, and the realities of transformation inside large organizations. We talk about why psychological safety isn’t about making people comfortable — it’s about making learning possible when the work is uncertain, awkward,…

Play episode WhatsApp Download

Earlier episodes 29 most recent

30 Sep 2026 · 37 min

Can Less Persuasion Create More Change? | Phill Agnew | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions this Change Signal conversation asks: Are you designing behaviour, or just explaining the change? Where does resistance actually come from? What small nudge might make the right action easier? In this episode, I talk with Phill Agnew, host of the marketing podcast Nudge, about what change leaders can learn from behavioural science — and why people are so much less rational than our change plans assume. We get into choice overload, loss aversion, social proof, defaults, friction, and reactance — the very human pushback that happens when people feel their autonomy is…
23 Sep 2026 · 32 min

Is Your Change Program a Chocolate Teapot? | Aidan McCullen | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here’s the revised version with an opening sentence and the three questions bulleted. This Change Signal conversation with Aidan McCullen asks three practical questions for anyone leading change in a large organization: What if change isn’t an event? Where does power really live? Who needs to win before transformation can move? Aidan McCullen, host of The Innovation Show and author of Undisruptable, joins me to talk about what it really takes to lead change when reinvention is no longer occasional but permanent. Aidan brings a useful dose of realism to change management, transformation, and…
16 Sep 2026 · 26 min

Your Change Strategy Isn't a Strategy | Alex M H Smith | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

This Change Signal conversation with Alex M H Smith asks three sharp questions: What unique value does your change work create? Who actually cares about it? What are you brave enough to remove? Alex is the author of No Bullsh*t Strategy, and he brings a gloriously skeptical eye to the foggy world of strategy, change management, and transformation. His central challenge is simple: most strategy isn’t strategy at all — it’s goals, optimization, or a vague wish wearing a business suit. We explore why internal change teams need to understand their own “unique value” to the business, why change…
9 Sep 2026 · 27 min

Should Change Teams Disappear? | Clay Parker Jones | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions from this Change Signal conversation: What if resistance is right? Where does change spread without permission? How close is your transformation work to customers and money? In this episode, I talk with Clay Parker Jones, author of Hidden Patterns: A Playbook for More Human Workplaces, about why change management often gets stuck — and what might actually help. Clay’s work is built around the idea of patterns: small, repeatable moves that can change how people work without requiring you to blow up the org chart. We talk about why old patterns are so seductive, how…
2 Sep 2026 · 29 min

How Change Really Travels | Greg Satell | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions from this Change Signal conversation with Greg Satell: What if change doesn’t move through hierarchy at all? What if silos are not the problem, but part of the solution? What if trying to persuade people is actually a warning sign? In this episode, I talk with Greg Satell about change management, transformation, and why large-scale change is less like a rollout and more like a cascade. Greg’s argument is wonderfully useful: change spreads through small groups, loosely connected, united by shared purpose. That means the job of a change leader is not to launch bigger,…
26 Aug 2026 · 31 min

Why Stories Matter More | Jennifer Garvey Berger | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Jennifer Garvey Berger’s three key insights: connectivity matters more than individual talent in complex systems; small experiments beat both over-planning and paralysis; and stories are legitimate measures of change before numbers shift. If you've ever had a change plan that hasn't quite gone according to plan (and honestly, who hasn't?), this conversation with Jennifer Garvey Berger will shift how you think about leading transformation. She's spent three decades figuring out what actually works when everything feels unpredictable and out of control. Jennifer challenges the "all-star team"…
19 Aug 2026 · 27 min

Is Your Organization Change Allergic? | Anne Gotte | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Three key insights from Anne Gotte: change management is as outdated as "personnel" organizations must diagnose their change allergies before attempting transformation; and leaders need to embrace clumsy imperfection while providing clear direction. Anne Gotte is SVP Global Talent & Organization Effectiveness at Mondelēz and she brings refreshing honesty to the messy reality of organizational transformation. She's worked at Bumble, Ecolab, and General Mills, collecting scars and wisdom along the way. This conversation challenges the traditional playbook. Anne argues that "decree change" —…
12 Aug 2026 · 36 min

Why You Build Belonging Before Belief | Hahrie Han | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three big insights that emerge from this Change Signal conversation with Hahrie Han: Are you creating value or just convenience?; Does belonging come before belief in your organization?; and Are you building agency or just compliance? Hahrie Han, political scientist at Johns Hopkins University and author of How Organizations Develop Activists and Undivided, has spent her career studying how people build power that lasts. She brings a sharp, human perspective on what drives genuine participation and why small, intentional acts often change systems more than sweeping plans. The…
5 Aug 2026 · 30 min

What Really Moves/Changes a System | Helen Bevan | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three provocative questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation with Helen Bevan: Is your belonging actually just assimilation? Are your relationships stronger than your strategy? And what fear is your system quietly running on? Helen Bevan has spent decades leading large-scale transformation inside the NHS, and she brings that rare blend of deep experience and fresh thinking. She makes a compelling case that the real levers of change aren’t the ones we normally obsess over—plans, resources, or methodologies—but the relational fabric that holds a system together. We talk…
29 Jul 2026 · 21 min

How to Build Real Agency | Cate Hall | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions this Change Signal conversation asks: What freedom are you not seeing yet? Where can you safely loosen control? When does agency become dangerous? In this episode, I talk with Cate Hall about agency — what it is, why it matters, and why it’s more complicated than simply telling people to “take ownership.” Cate defines agency as the ability to see and act on degrees of freedom other people overlook, which is a powerful idea for anyone leading change, transformation, or large-scale organizational work. We get into how leaders can become more agentic without becoming…
22 Jul 2026 · 27 min

How AI Changes Change Leadership | Brian Evergreen | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions from this Change Signal conversation: Are we chasing AI, or value? What future are we actually building? What would have to be true to get there? In this episode, I talk with Brian Evergreen, author of Autonomous Transformation, about what change leadership looks like when AI is moving faster than most organizations can think. Brian makes a wonderfully useful distinction: your job is probably not to become an AI expert. Your job is to understand value — for your customers, your organization, and the wider system — and then partner with the right expertise to create…
15 Jul 2026 · 29 min

Is Your Change Too Big? | Jana Werner | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation: What intelligence are you wasting? Who really owns the change? What needs to go first? In this episode, I talk with Jana Werner about why so much change management still feels like something done to people, rather than with them. Jana argues that large organizations often hire smart, capable people — and then design transformation in ways that sideline their judgment, curiosity, and ownership. We explore why top-down change may feel faster at first, but often becomes slower because it doesn’t stick. We also get into…
8 Jul 2026 · 23 min

Leading Change Without Permission | Alex Budak | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation: Who gave you permission to lead? What if 25 percent is enough? Where have you become the hub? In this episode, I talk with Alex Budak, UC Berkeley faculty member and author of Becoming a Changemaker, about how change leadership actually spreads through an organization. We explore why people wait too long to claim the role of changemaker, and why permission often has to be taken rather than granted. Alex makes the case that change management is not a heroic solo act — it’s a team sport, built through values, courage,…
1 Jul 2026 · 29 min

Clarity>Certainty. Context>Content | Peter Schein | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

This Change Signal conversation with Peter Schein asks three questions: • What doesn’t your change plan know? • Where is context quietly defeating content? • Are we building systems so perfect that people no longer need to be good? Peter, co-author with Ed Schein of Humble Inquiry, Humble Consulting, and Humble Leadership, brings a wonderfully useful challenge to change management and transformation work. He says humble leadership isn’t about being modest; it’s about being vulnerable to what you don’t know, and curious enough to discover what the room already knows. We talk about why change…
24 Jun 2026 · 29 min

Two Types of Change Harm | Kate O'Neill | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Three questions sit at the heart of this conversation: • Are you starting with the technology, or the purpose?• What harm are you creating by moving too fast — or too slowly?• Have you designed the change people actually experience? Kate O’Neill is a tech humanist, strategist, and author of What Matters Next. In this Change Signal episode, we talk about AI, digital transformation, and the choices change leaders face when the world keeps speeding up. Kate challenges one of the loudest instincts in organizations right now: “We need an AI strategy.” Maybe. But not first. First comes purpose:…
17 Jun 2026 · 28 min

How to Make Change Real | Roger Martin | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Three questions sit at the heart of this conversation: Are you asking people to make real choices, or just comply? What past are you accidentally disrespecting? Is your change work actually part of the work? Roger Martin is one of the clearest thinkers I know on strategy, leadership, and transformation. In this Change Signal episode, we get into why so many change efforts stall, not because people are lazy or resistant, but because they’ve been given a vague or demeaning job: “go execute this.” Roger offers a better way: choice chartering. Give people the shape of the answer you need, not…
10 Jun 2026 · 29 min

Designing Behavior Change That Sticks | BJ Fogg | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

This Change Signal conversation with BJ Fogg raises three interesting questions: Are you designing change, or just hoping for it? Where’s the overlap that actually works? What is your environment quietly shaping? Behaviour ch Change sits at the heart of every transformation effort, yet most leaders still rely on willpower, communication, and good intentions. BJ Fogg offers a more practical approach — one grounded in designing for behaviour rather than trying to persuade it. We explore his core model: behaviour happens when motivation, ability, and prompts come together. Miss one, and change…
3 Jun 2026 · 37 min

Power Mapping for Change Practitioners & Leaders | Tiziana Casciaro | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation with Tiziana Casciaro: Where does power really sit in your system? Why don’t people use your “open door”? When is resistance a skill gap — and when is it a coalition fight? Most change efforts in big organizations fail for a quiet reason: we pretend change is a plan, when it’s actually a power-and-relationships story. Tiziana helps make “power” discussable again — less as a dirty word, more as the energy that moves decisions, resources, and attention. We talk about power mapping as a practical discipline: noticing who’s…
27 May 2026 · 33 min

Conversations: The Atomic Unit of Change | Daniel Stillman | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three tensions that emerge from this Change Signal conversation with Daniel Stillman: Who actually owns the change? What conversations are you avoiding? Are you inviting people — or forcing them? If you lead change in a large organization, you already know this: great strategy and clear comms aren’t enough. Daniel Stillman — author of Good Talk — makes the case that conversations are the real engine of change, and most of us are underpowered. We explore why one-to-many communication rarely shifts behavior, and why many-to-many conversations — messy, slower, harder — are where…
20 May 2026 · 26 min

Map Your Culture’s Hidden System | Siobhán McHale | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three provocative questions at the centre of this Change Signal conversation with Siobhán McHale: Are you trying to change a machine, a network, or an ecosystem? What patterns are quietly running your culture? How do you intervene without getting “organ rejected”? Siobhán has spent two decades as an “insider,” rolling up her sleeves inside organizations to make change actually happen. In this episode, she shares why most change leadership still leans too heavily on IQ and EQ — and why the next capability is what she calls group intelligence: the ability to see the system, not just…
13 May 2026 · 28 min

How Your Origin Story Runs Your Change Program | Ron Carucci | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation with Ron Carucci: Are we still managing change as if it’s predictable? What unseen stories are really shaping how our organizations behave? And where might leaders themselves be quietly getting in the way? Change management, as most of us were taught it, assumes a linear path: a clear “from,” a clear “to,” and a plan to get there. In this conversation, Ron Carucci makes the case that those days are over. For leaders running complex change in large organizations, the real work now is less about managing transitions and…
6 May 2026 · 30 min

How to Start a Change Initiative | Bryan Walker | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that sit at the heart of this Change Signal conversation with Bryan Walker: What are you changing too early? Where are you too far away? And what real issue are you avoiding? Bryan Walker, longtime IDEO partner, joins me to explore a different way of thinking about change and transformation in large organizations. We talk about why so many change efforts stall—not because of bad strategy, but because they’re designed too linearly, too distantly, and too separate from the work itself. Bryan challenges the instinct to start with structure and big plans. Instead, he…
29 Apr 2026 · 32 min

Just How Dead is Change Management? | Caroline Kealey | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Three questions this Change Signal conversation with Caroline Kealey invites you to sit with: What old model are you still relying on? What are you actually moving toward? Are you creating clarity or just more noise? I came across Caroline’s work through a sharp claim: change management is dead. And as we dig into it, you’ll see why that might be less dramatic than it sounds — and more useful than it first appears. Caroline Kealey is an executive facilitator working at the intersection of change, leadership, and communication. What she names clearly is this: the nature of change has shifted.…
22 Apr 2026 · 31 min

The OG of Scenario Planning for Change Management | Jeremy Bentham | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions that sit underneath this Change Signal conversation with Jeremy Bentham: What future are you not exploring? Where is your strategy getting lazy? Are you helping people learn — or making them resist? If you lead change in a large organization, you already know the future refuses to behave. Jeremy Bentham —who led Shell’s scenario planning team for sixteen years and helped shape how one of the world’s most sophisticated organizations thinks about uncertainty — joins me to explore how to work with that reality rather than fight it. His core idea is simple but demanding:…
17 Apr 2026 · 21 min

Kübler-Ross was Wrong About Change! | Jacqueline Kappers | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions sparked by this Change Signal conversation with Jacqueline Kappers: What loss are you ignoring in your latest transformation? Where might you be grief-shaming your people? What would change look like if you treated it as individual, not linear? If you lead change projects inside a large organization, you already know that most transformation efforts struggle not because the strategy is wrong, but because the human response is misunderstood. In this episode, Jacqueline Kappers challenges the reflex use of the Kübler-Ross grief curve in change management. It was never…
15 Apr 2026 · 36 min

AI Won’t Fix Your Change Problem. (Sorry.) | Andrew Kilshaw | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

As I reflect on this conversation with Andrew Kilshaw, three questions stand out: Who are you really trying to move? What recipe are you missing? Is AI saving you — or just augmenting you? Andrew Kilshaw has led transformation inside organizations like Nike, Sanofi, BlackRock, and Shell, and now works at the intersection of change and AI. He brings both experience and perspective — someone who’s seen what actually works when theory meets reality. If you lead change in a large organization, you already know this: not everyone is coming with you. Andrew Kilshaw offers a practical way to work…
8 Apr 2026 · 33 min

Let’s Netflix and Change | Jessica Neal | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three provocative questions that arise from this Change Signal conversation with Jessica Neal: Are you modeling the change you’re asking for? What nostalgia is quietly slowing your organization down? And are you chasing consensus when you should be making decisions? If you lead change in a large organization, you already know the challenge isn’t just strategy. It’s people, pace, and the gravitational pull of the status quo. In this conversation, Jessica Neal — former Chief Talent Officer at Netflix — shares what it actually takes to shift culture and move transformation forward…
1 Apr 2026 · 37 min

Stop Writing Boring Change Management Messaging | Donald Miller | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions to sharpen your thinking from this Change Signal conversation with Donald Miller: What story are your people living inside? Are you the hero of the change — or the guide? Can your strategy fit on a napkin? If you lead transformation inside a large organization, you already know this: change management fails less because of bad strategy and more because of bad framing. Donald argues that every human being sees themselves as the hero in a story — and if you want to shift behavior, energy, and buy-in, you must change the plot points of that story. We explore why leaders…
25 Mar 2026 · 28 min

Where Should You Intervene for Change Impact? | Dr. Leyla Acaroglu | Modern Change Management & Leading Change

Here are three questions to sharpen your thinking from this Change Signal conversation with Dr. Leyla Acaroglu What are you editing out of your understanding of the problem? Where are you treating a living system like a tidy plan? And what intervention would actually shift the dynamics? Dr. Leyla Acaroglu is a sustainability strategist, systems thinker, and founder of Disrupt Design. Her work sits at the intersection of design, behaviour, and complex systems, helping leaders move beyond surface-level fixes to understand how change actually happens in messy, real-world environments. If you…

About Change Signal: Modern Change Management that Works

Change management is harder than ever. Organizations face more complexity, more uncertainty, and more pressure to deliver successful change than at any point in recent memory. Most leaders respond by pushing harder. Others search for the latest model, framework, or methodology and hope the tool will solve the problem. Neither guarantees change adoption. Successful change happens when people are ready, stakeholders are engaged, leaders show up effectively, and change approaches fit the reality of the work. That's what Change Signal explores. Michael Bungay Stanier, author of The Coaching Habit and a student of organizational change for more than thirty years, talks with leading thinkers, experienced practitioners, and senior leaders to uncover what works, what doesn't, and what modern change management looks like in practice. Each episode explores the challenges behind leading successful change, building change readiness, strengthening stakeholder engagement, improving change adoption, applying change frameworks, refining change methodology, and measuring change effectiveness. Whether you're leading a change project, supporting organizational change, or helping teams navigate uncertainty, you'll find practical ideas, tested approaches, and evidence-based insights you can put to work immediately. The goal is simple: help change practitioners and change leaders make change more successful, more sustainable, and less overwhelming. New episodes regularly. Join the conversation…

Change Signal: Modern Change Management that Works is a English business podcast from Michael Bungay Stanier | Modern Change Management Practitioner. Melo plays each episode straight from the publisher's own feed — no ads added, no account needed — and remembers where you stopped, in this browser only.

Publisher: Michael Bungay Stanier | Modern Change Management Practitioner
Language: English
Category: Business
New episodes: Weekly
Typical length: 29 min
Latest episode: 7 Oct 2026
Feed: RSS — paste into any podcast app
Apple Podcasts: podcasts.apple.com/podcast/id1793189341

RSS feed Apple Podcasts

More English business 6

Take it with you

The Melo app keeps playing with the screen off, works in the car and on your watch, wakes you to your station, and browses the whole catalogue offline. Free, no ads, no account.