We'd Rather Be Alive Than Be Liked

0:00[upbeat music] Hi, welcome to Ask a Jew, where a secular, sinful Israeli speaks to her holy religious friend. I'm Yael, here with Chayele. We're the JD Vance in Pakistan of Judaism. [laughs] Which one am I? Uh, I... It doesn't matter because it all exploded. I mean- So [laughs] I, I do, I do not wish us, I do not wish us that, um, ending. No, I do not wish that on us. No. But also, did you know that Pakistan was a country that had people capable of negotiating on behalf of- I mean... Iran? I'm happy for them that they're stepping up.

0:36You're happy for Iran [laughs] I'm happy for them that they're stepping up. Yeah. Yeah. Um- Good for them... it's about time. Good for them. It's not like they're Eurovision or anything. It's like, what else are they doing? It's so true. Um, but we've, we haven't spoken in a while. There's so much going on. I know. Um, but I think what our listeners really want us to address is, like, the most important thing on everybody's mind that happened in the last couple weeks, which is Abby and David from Love on the Spectrum broke up.

1:04I know. I'm so sad about it. I... Y- I mean, my sister called me. [laughs] My sister does not call me. I got messages. I'm not the one that listens to this show. I d- Uh... obviously. No, no, no. But- I got messages. I know. I mean, wow. One of my sons asked if I'm gonna try to- Can we send baby Vance there? Maybe. Or Steve Witkoff- Yeah... at least. Or Steve Witkoff, yeah. Yeah, Steve Witkoff at least can go- [laughs]... try to settle a truce between them. It's so s- But you know what? I saw... I don't know if you watched the last season, but you could- I've, I, I haven't...

1:38you could tell that, I mean, if you read between the lines, and, you know, we're all hindsight is 20/20. But now if I'll go and re-watch it, and I will, um, y- you can see the, the cracks in that relationship. So I've been reading stuff online about them- Mm-hmm... 'cause I was out of it. I had to not use my phone for, like, 25 days over Passover, and so I missed a lot of things. It- But- Insane. Neglect... this second I turned my phone off, uh, I turned my phone on, it was about Abby and David, 100 messages coming in. I mean, we're team David just to confirm, right?

2:10Well, well, one of the people pointed out, and I'm wondering what you think about this, but someone pointed out that they feel that Abby is a lot more high-functioning than David, and so maybe it was- Oh, yeah... a mismatch. He is way out of his league. Yeah, I think it might have been a mismatch. But I- She... Yeah... they were just so cute and sweet with each other, and they loved the lions. I'm sad that- They love- What are the lions? Who's gonna tell the lions? [laughs] Anyway, if you don't know what we're talking about- Yeah... shame on you, A.

2:39Um, you clearly hate people on the spectrum if you don't know what we're talking about. Um, it's hard to sell that show to your friends because whenever I tell my friends, "Oh my God, you have to watch this show, Love on the Spectrum," they're like- Yeah... "No, that sounds really cringey, and it sounds- It's actually not... like, that it exploits them." And I'm like, "I know it sounds like- It's not... all those things, but it's not." Well, s- I, I, I wish I came up with this myself, but I was reading a Substack piece about this, and someone was saying- [laughs]...

3:06that the reason [laughs] people love the show so much and why we should encourage people to watch it is because actually everyone needs the advice and the guidance that they're giving the, the pa- participants in that show. Like, my regular Hillel students- Yeah... okay, not to use the word regular, I don't mean it like that, but my non-autistic Hillel students- Mm-hmm... also really need- Which is half of your Hillel students... well, they also need all of that advice, and they also need- Yeah... and I mean, even, uh, like, I talk to my kids about it, right?

3:37Like, they are guiding them so carefully with so much support and love that it's really for everyone. And, and honestly, I wanna say this, like, if you have a kid, if you're... You, dear listener, if you have a child who is in their 20s and you're like, "Why aren't they dating?" You should watch Love on the Spectrum- Uh-huh... and help them through it. They need you. And I, I was watching, like, one of the episodes I watched the other day, um, the dating coach was, you know, going through a conversation with one of the people and saying like, "Okay, if you're gonna sit down at the table," and say, "What's a good question that you can ask the person across from you?"

4:12Mm-hmm. And so he said, "What are your hobbies?" And she was like, "Great, that's a great question. So let's say she answers she likes to sew. What should you say next?" Mm-hmm. And he was like, uh, you know, he couldn't think of it, and she said, "Well, why don't you say, 'What kind of things do you like to sew?'" Or- Tell me... like she would- They always say tell me more... "Tell me more about that." Tell me more about that. Right? Like, who doesn't need... In 2026, who doesn't need that kind of coaching? It's not just for people on the spectrum.

4:37So I encourage everyone to watch it, and if you have kids in the dating age range, you should also watch it. That's my advice. What I love most about the show, and then we'll go, we'll talk about Jewish things if we must. [laughs] Um, although there is a Jewish angle. David is Jewish. Yeah. Um, Abby, is Abby Jewish? Maybe. Maybe that's why they broke up. No, Abby's not Jewish. Oh, there you go. Sh- shiksa. Right. Shiksas are for practice, David probably said to himself.

5:03Um, no, but what I love most about that show, and, and I, I don't have any, knock wood, disability in my family, so it's not something that I'm familiar with. Yeah. But the parents and the siblings- Oh, I know... the way they interact with the kids- I know... is b- both beautiful, but also there's so much humor in it. Yeah. And they can- Yeah... the kids are in on the jokes. The parents kinda rib them a little bit. Yeah. And it's just so, uh, it, it's beautiful, and I know these parents are probably have, like, the hardest- I know... most difficult, like, parenting jobs in the world.

5:40Uh, and they manage to kind of, I don't know, it, like-... joke around with their kids about their disabilities. Mm-hmm. It's very endearing. But doesn't it make you realize that everyone needs that kind of support? It's not... Like, anyone who has a 23-year-old or 25-year-old or a 28-year-old, like, they need you. They need, they desperately need you, and they need the kind of advice and support that those kids are getting on Love on the Spectrum.

6:04I mean, I have adult children now, and I see that they need us to help them walk through many different things that they're going through in their lives. And I know that's counterintuitive, because a lot of times the kids are like, "I don't need you. I don't want you." Yeah. "I know better than you." And, and that's, um, my kids do the same thing to me. My kid's biggest joke in our f- in our house is like, uh, "You don't know anything. You were born with the 19 in the year," you know- [laughs] Yeah... before, you know. You have a 19 in your birth year.

6:31But at the end of the day, guess what? When they're going through something, who are they calling? They're calling us, and they need us to walk them through it, whether it's work-related- I mean, I still-... school-related... call my parents- Yeah... for advice on everything. Yeah. Exactly. E- exactly, and we need to be able to provide that kind of support to them. That's all. I really- All right, do you wanna talk, do you wanna talk about Jewish things? I think we should have Nadav Eyal and Amit Segal on to talk about Love on the Spectrum. And I want them to fight about it. [laughs] Oh, yeah.

6:57I'm gonna ask them, which character are you most like? [laughs] Are you- Oh. Oh, we could play this game forever. Who- I know... like, who's who. I know. A- Amit is definitely the guy with the long hair. I forgot his name, who's kind of like feisty. Oh, James. Yeah, James. James, yeah. Yeah, he's kinda scary. And Nadav- Um... is, uh... I don't know. Nadav's David. Conner? Yeah, maybe. Con- no, Conner's a little too edgy. Yeah. [laughs] Anyway, yeah, yeah, duh, don't, you know, don't worry, we're gonna talk about Jewish things or whatever. Ah. Um, how was your Pesach? Wow. Wow. It was a lot. It was great. It was hard.

7:35It was- You have to, if I understand the traditions correctly of your people, every Pesach you have to burn down your entire house. Yeah, [laughs] pretty much. Okay. Well, we just moved out, so it was a little- Okay... easier this year. Wait. But- If you move out, you don't have to fumigate the whole house? No. You just, like- What?... close it off. What? Yeah. But there's, that is such a philosophical, interesting question, because if a house is, has chametz in the forest, does it still have chametz in it? Well, we sell all of our chametz, always- Okay... no matter what.

8:05So we didn't own any chametz, and we didn't see any of it because we weren't here. So- But it was still in the house. Like, there were still crumbs. Yeah, but we weren't here. Yeah, but- But what I'm saying, it still existed in a universe. Yeah, but why, think about the question, why are you getting rid of your chametz? Oh. So that you don't eat it. I, I'm, I don't. I just put them in a bag in the fridge. Well, I'm saying, why would one, why would one be obligated to not have chametz in their possession or to see it? It's so that they wouldn't by accident eat it.

8:30If I'm not physically in this house, I can't eat my chametz, so it's not an issue. You know, I had a really tough- You smell it though... I had a really tough Pesach because, uh, a few days before I went to Trader Joe's and I bought those called the cone ice creams. Yeah. You know those? They're so good. Yeah. And I couldn't eat them. They're chametz. And I considered, a few times I considered eating just the top part- Yeah... without the cone. That would be okay. But I d- I couldn't do that to Hashem. Wow, I'm so proud of you. Thank you.

8:55Do you think it's 'cause we're in a war? Are you more- Um... conscious of things 'cause, like, do you feel like you have to be better 'cause there's a war? I, I'm like that, but- I sometimes feel like I have to be better before flights. Yeah. [laughs] Um, like I'm not accidentally gonna get drunk and eat a cheeseburger before a flight. Yeah. Um- I know... maybe. M- I mean, it didn't seem to help though. [laughs] Well, I don't know. Look, a lot of... No, thank God no one was killed I don't think over P- well, was, were any people hurt in the various- Yeah.

9:24Uh, people were, like, over this war? No, no, over Pesach. Over the last... Oh, over Pesach? I don't think anybody was killed. I don't know what day it is. I don't know what time it is. I know. I know. I don't know what month it is. Well- I have two trips in May. Do you think I know when they are and if they're not at the same date? There could very well be a Pesach date. Do you know when May is? Do you even know when- May? Yeah, when is May? I think it's- I don't even know what day we are... after April... yeah, I'm saying I don't even know when- Which we may or may not be in right now. [laughs] I don't know.

9:49[laughs] Well, I could say one thing about my holiday. Um, we had in, outside of Israel we celebrate two days of each, the beginning and the end. Mm-hmm. So it's many days of not using our phones and not using cars and not, you know, all of that. So we had three days in a row from Wednesday night to Saturday night that we didn't use our phones, and then again the following week on Tuesday and Wednesday and Thursday. I'm here for you. So, or, or basically Wednesday and Thursday. I cannot tell you how amazing it was. I know it's crazy, and I dread it. I had anxiety about it.

10:23I would never admit this to my kids because when they complain about it I'm always like, "Oh my God, who cares? What's the big deal?" I was- No, it's like getting off drugs... I was dreading. I had so much anxiety about not having my phone for three days. I'm telling you, I cannot stress this enough to everyone, it is the biggest gift and blessing that we give ourselves. My kids, who I haven't been together with, I've seen all my kids over the last six months, but we have not all been together, the six of us, in six months, okay?

10:52We would never have had the time we had together if not for that. Like- Mm... sitting around on the couches doing nothing, talking, laughing, playing Settlers of Catan over and over again. Mm-hmm. Playing games, reading magazines together. Like, when are we doing... The second the holiday is over or Shabbat is over, you can't get a single one of us to look at each other. Not one. Yeah. Like, I couldn't even look at them. [laughs] And I love my children, but I'm like, "Get away from me, I'm on my phone."

11:18And I just, it's such a gift and I really, really, really wish that people would somehow adopt that practice. I don't care if you don't keep Shabbat, but, like, somehow adopt the practice of not using your phones. It's, it's, it's mind-blowing how great it is for you. Yeah. It's great. I- We, we were talking before and I mentioned that I'm reading, um, Arthur Brooks's, uh, new book now. Yeah. Uh, which is ki- I f- it's got, like, a really bad name. It's called, like, The Meaning of Your Life or something. Yeah. [laughs] But just Google Arthur Brooks's new book.

11:48Um- And it's really good, and we know all these things. Right. He's not, like, saying anything new. Nobody ever is. Uh, I mean, that's not a knock on him. That's just... you know. But he talks about the, the phone and the... how, like, real growth comes from, like, just being with your discomfort a little bit. Yeah. And we're so quick and, and, you know, I- Mm-hmm... I'm... I do this all the time. Like, we're so quick to reach for our phone- Yeah... or a vape or whatever every time we're uncomfortable. Food, you know. Yeah, yeah. Um, and it's so important to be in those, like, boring...

12:21You know, when are we ever bored? We're never bored. Right. Right. Well, yesterday, it's interesting, because yesterday, Shabbat now ends much later 'cause of- Mm-hmm... the time change. So Shabbat didn't end last night until about 8:05 or something. By 5:30, I was getting really antsy. Like, I was truly... Like, everybody was napping, and I had already napped, so I was, like, doing a puzzle downstairs. Mm. But I got bored, 'cause, like, I, when I... usually, when I puzzle, I have my phone on and I'm listening to a podcast or, you know, whatever. I was sitting there in the silence.

12:54I didn't have music, and I was just puzzling. And I... so I got up and I just found myself, like, doing circles around my kitchen island [laughs], you know, like- [laughs]... sort of grazing. I do that at work sometimes. Yeah, like sort of- Oh... grazing, and then sort of like... and then I went to read, but I c- I had no patience, and then I went outside. I was genuinely bored. Like, I hadn't felt that way in a really long time. And you know what I ended up doing? I ended up reading for a long time, and I, I really enjoyed it after. Yeah. But it was hard. That, those few minutes that I was, like, really a- antsy, it was hard. Yeah.

13:28And I, I forgot how that felt, you know, not to have something. Do you find, b- because you do have that, like, muscle memory of not being with your phone once a week, do you find that it's easier for you... I, I can read nonfiction... or, or sorry, I can read fiction pretty easily. Yeah. But nonfiction, the, even the ones that I really wanna read, it's so hard for me to sit and, like... Even the Arthur Brooks thing, I'm listening to it on Audible. Yeah. Um, a lot of times I'll listen to an article- Really?... uh, instead of read it. Like, a- and I think that's just a muscle. Yeah, yeah.

13:59I mean- Like, is it easier for you 'cause you're, you do it once a week? Yeah, I mean, I find with reading, we've talked about this before, but it's a discipline. I mean, I will have to, like, say to myself, "I'm putting my phone away and I'm reading for 20 minutes or 30 minutes or whatever." Or, like, we're doing the Life in Fate book right now, our group of friends- Yeah... and we read a chapter a day, and that sort of, that helps me. Like, I have, like, a discipline about it, and it makes it, it forces me to do it. Otherwise, it's really hard. It is really hard. Yeah. And I'm just...

14:30I, I, I don't know. I wish I had more patience to sit and read for longer periods of time, 'cause you know what? It's BS that I don't have time. You know, people are like, "Oh, my God, I have no time." I have time. Yeah. And I can read more, you know what I mean? Yeah. Like, I can definitely read more. You and I both find time. Um, yeah. Yeah. It's hard. It's, it's, it's... like, I think it's training and, like, uh, you know, I, I compare it to running a little bit. Like, that, when you first start running- Yeah... you can't run more than five minutes, and then- Yeah...

14:56and by the way, every time I run, I still, the first few minutes, sometimes even the first few miles, it's still, like- It's so hard... huge. Yeah. Like, my body's like, "What the hell are you doing right now? This is awful." Yeah. Uh, and then you kinda smooth into it, so. Do you have... Well, one of the things that I've done, I'm curious if you do this. Like, I've had to find a way physically that I'm comfortable reading again, 'cause I, when I... growing up my whole life, I could... you could put me upside down on the stairs- Wow.... and I could read.

15:27You know what I mean? Yeah. I would lay in bed for hours and read. I would lay on the couch. I would... I mean, I could read anywhere. I find that I'm not physically comfortable in those positions anymore. Oh, interesting. And so I had to figure out the best way for me to read. Like, that I'm holding a, a heavier book or a hardcover book or, you know, whatever. And so I figured out, like, at my dining room table, I sit in a really comfortable chair. I have, like, a, my stack of books there.

15:52When that's all set up for me, I'm m- it, I'm tend to go there more often and sit down and read. But, like, when I put everything away, 'cause I'm, like, let's say setting up for Shabbat or whatever- Mm... so I put away all the books and I move all the chairs, like, then I lose that, you know? And I don't find another comfortable space. Do you have something like that? I... yeah. I, I, first of all, I don't sit, you know? I, that's- Yeah... I, because of my back, it's, like, the, terrible for me. So I lie on my couch. Mm-hmm. Um, and I also bought a beanbag- Oh... um, because I... Okay, so here's what... do... here's my beanbag tragedy.

16:25[laughs] It's, it's, it's a tragic story. So they get issues. And I'm sure there's a lesson- Yeah... in it somewhere. This is my third beanbag, okay? Okay. That I bought. Now, I buy it purely for comfort. It's not pretty. I don't have room for it. It's not decorative. [laughs] I'm like, here's what happens to me every time. I go to a store. Mm. I see a beanbag. I lie down on it. I'm like, "This is the most amazing thing ever for my back. I love it. I'm gonna sit here. I'm gonna read. I'm gonna, like, smoke a pipe." I don't know what. Yeah. Like, you know, it just- [laughs]...

16:55it, to me, I envision it like, like an old, like, Victorian house that has, like, a library and a fireplace. Yeah, yeah. Like, that is the beanbag for me. So I buy one on Amazon. Too puffy, okay? Oh, my God. Too... I return it. Do you know how hard it is to return a beanbag, Chaila? No, I can't even imagine. That shit expands. [laughs] That's the whole point. So imagine having to stuff it back into a box. No. [laughs] You have to return it, 'cause they're like $200. You don't wanna be like, "Okay, whatever." But- Eventually I buy another one... why don't you buy the one from the store that you like? Because...

17:28so that's what happened. I went to a store. I went to Muji, and I saw one. I was like, "Oh, my God, this is perfect." I laid down, it's amazing. I buy it- Yeah... online, and then it's the same thing. And then I realize the beanbags, they're not comfortable. They become- Oh, I see... when people sit on them all the time- Right... they lose their shape. Yeah. That's when most people get a new beanbag, and that's when I need a- So you, you need patience. That's what you need. I have none You need to have patience to break it in. I also need a big dog. Like, if I have...

17:59When I foster the dogs, I always make them sit on the beanbag 'cause they're very heavy. Yeah. Um, I need a heavy person to come in here three, four times a week- [laughs]... and sit on my beanbag for me. Gary, put that on indeed.com. Get like- [laughs]... or one of the job sites. On Tinder. TaskRabbit, TaskRabbit. TaskRabbit. I need someone heavy to come in and sit on my beanbag. [laughs] Yeah. Well, but I would like- Otherwise, I, I read in bed. I read in- Oh, I can't anymore... I put my Kindle... I have, like, a Kindle, um- Oh... folding Kindle thing. Yeah. Like a book. Yeah.

18:31And that way I don't have to touch it. Mm. And I mean, just to switch pages, and I just, uh, lie on my side, and it's right in front of me, and it's amazing. See, I guess that's my problem is 'cause I still read books, so I need to hold them, and they're heavy, and my arms hurt, and then- No, both. Do both. I can't lap- Alternate. I mean, you've seen my body. I don't really have a lap, you know? It's not like there's space for a book. [laughs] No, a Kindle- So I- Don't res- don't be one of those Luddites that are like, "I don't want a Kindle." [laughs] "I'm not...

18:56I don't want a Mac." You know those people who are like- No, I love that. I love that... "I'm not gonna have a Mac." I don't... You know how you ask somebody, "Hey, have you watched Love on the Spectrum?" No. And instead of saying no, they'll be like, "I don't have a TV." I know. I know. Okay, what do you think, you're better than me that you don't have a Kindle? [laughs] You're not. No. You just have a- I just like-... ton of books... books. No, but my biggest issue... Okay, only short people are gonna relate to this. My biggest issue is that my l- feet don't touch the ground on many chairs. Mm-hmm.

19:22And it's not comfortable, so I- Mm... always have to have... Like, right now I'm sitting at my desk. I have a stool for my feet- Yeah... 'cause, like, I can't sit comfortably. Uh, so I have the same thing with reading. I need my feet to be, like, grounded. I need to be comfortable, and then I can read. I, I'm just encouraging people, find a comfortable place and position, and maybe you'll read more. I don't know. Yeah. You never know. Read, uh, Love on the Spectrum, the novel. Can I... [laughs] Can I tell you something about... One thing I'll tell you, I woke up on the last day of Passover with that feeling in your stomach.

19:56You know that pit in your stomach of anxiety- Mm... and nausea and stress and, like, your heartbeat- No... and, like... I don't know if you ever get that, but I- Oh, yeah. Only every morning when I wake up. I get it. [laughs] Yeah. I woke up on the last day of Pesach with it, and I was trying to think about why, and I realized that basically from Hanukkah, which is in December, until Passover, which is sometime in April, any important thing that I have to do, I say, "I'll do it after Pesach."

20:23Mm. I'm gonna deal with it after Pesach. I'm gonna think about it after Pesach. All of it, right? And guess what? Thursday when I woke up, I'm like, oh, holy shit, it's after- Yeah... Pesach. Now what? So I'm struggling, 'cause now I'm just transitioning from I'm gonna think about it after Pesach. Now it's like, that's something I should deal with after the summer. Let me get through the summer months. Ah. And, and- What's your... What's on your to-do list? Just to get- Maybe we'll help you- All the stuff... the, the listeners. All the things. I need to make appointments. I need to go there. I need to deal with this.

20:53You know, all the things. I need to think about- Yeah... the staffing structure for Hillel for next year. I need to think about... You know, blah, blah, blah, on and on. Stuff for my kids, stuff for this, that, shidduch, whatever. All of it was after Pesach. Now it's after Pesach. Have you heard of, um, this, um, this, uh, thing called temptation bundling? What's that? Where if there's something you really like to do, but, like, that's not, you know, the best thing, like watching TV or smoking or eat- drinking a milkshake, whatever, then you do it only with the thing that you have to do.

21:28So let's say people are like, "Oh, I have to walk or run on the treadmill, so I'll w- I'll save my favorite show for that." Right. Um- Oh. Yeah. That's a good idea. It tells... Well, can I take- So I've done a-... Love on the Spectrum to my mammogram? Is that what we're saying? Like- 100%. [laughs] I've been pushing off my mammogram. That takes a half hour. Why is it such a big deal? The mammogram? I, I... Yeah. What's the big deal? 'Cause the mammogram isn't the problem. It's the waiting after the mammogram to... and thinking about all the things that you have. No, I don't even care about that. You know what's hard for me? Mm.

21:59Making the appointment. I want to hire someone to just make me appointments. That's it. Oh. I- I could go- Yeah. If someone tells me, "Be at your mammogram at 10:30 on Monday," I've n- I will be there no problem. Yeah. It's getting... It's making that appointment. I don't know why I have a- So next time you want to do something stupid-... disability... I mean- Yeah... and fun, then be like, "Okay, I'm gonna... only gonna do this after I make the appointment." Mm. I'm gonna try that. I do that, I do that all the time with things. Really? Like, I... Yeah. It doesn't always work, but, you know- I don't know... it's...

22:34With vaping, 'cause I vape, and by the way, I got a lockbox. Um, shout out to our listener/friend Alyssa, who recommended a lockbox. Um- Oh, how's that? It's great. I put it in... And this is how dumb we are as human beings. Like, I literally had to pay money- [laughs]... to protect myself from myself. Um- I get it... so I put the vapes in there, and I lock it in a moment of weakness, and I lock it for how many ever hours I want to. And then sometimes I sit around it, like, like my sister's cat has an automatic feeder. Yeah.

23:07And sometimes the cat will just go to the automatic feeder and just, like, look at it longingly and 'cause- [laughs]... then wait for it to open. Sometimes I do that. Oh my God. Um, but, um, but the- Can you override it? Yeah, but I don't know how, and I'm not... I don't want to learn. Oh, interesting. Okay. Um, but, um, but the thing is, with vaping, when I had a big writing project, um, I told myself, "Okay, I'm only gonna vape when I write." Right. And guess what? I was like, "Okay, can't wait to w- open that Word document."

23:37Oh. Did it... And so it worked. It worked. That's incredible. Yeah. Can I put my whole fridge and pantry in the lockbox? [laughs] In a lockbox? Yeah. [laughs] You can get a lockbox for your house, like a- Can I get a lockbox? [laughs] Yeah. I'm gonna put everything I own, my computer, my phone- Yeah, your husband-... all this food... would love that, that you lock the fridge... my husband. [laughs] Yeah. It's all gonna go in the lockbox. Yeah, but we're constantly have to trick ourselves into doing- I know... things.

24:04And, and Arthur Brooks talks about in the book too about, like, doing, you know, like, d- doing the things that don't feel good but make you feel good. Yeah. Like exercise and stuff like that. Like, you know, if I have days where I'm working out, um, in... Especially if I'm, I'm working out in the morning, which I rarely do, but I've done twice this week for reasons that I force myself to. You feel so... You do feel good after. So good. And it's not like you don't feel tired and ache. You do. No. But, like, you feel like- Yeah... accomplished. 100%. I- And do you think I enjoy it? No, I hate every minute of it.

24:38Could you imag- This week is Yom HaShoah, Holocaust Remembrance Day. Could you imagine our grandparents listening to this conversation? [laughs] Yeah. [laughs] Could you imagine my grandmother- Yeah... listening to me complain about that I need a lockbox around my fridge and my phone? Yeah. I mean, she would be- And she would be like-... ashamed... "Oh my gosh, you have food in your fridge?" I know. No, it's so embarrassing how weak we are. It's... I'm embarrassed. But, but [laughs] this is the funniest thing. [laughs] We have an event today for Yom HaShoah in the community. Shout out. It's amazing. I'm so happy.

25:10Shout out to Jewish Long Beach for making this event, but- Oh, she's about to say something really nasty. I am. Okay, what's up? [laughs] So I told my boys that they had to go, 'cause they're still here. They're going back to yeshiva tomorrow. I told them they have to come with us to this Yom HaShoah event, and my son... I was kind of joking, 'cause I know they're home so little, and today is Sunday, and it's full of sports day, and that's all my kids want, is to watch sports when they're not in yeshiva, whatever.

25:35So I knew that I was gonna needle them. So I was like, "Guys, you have to come. It's at 12:30 in the middle of the day. We're going to this Yom HaShoah event." And my son was like, "I am not going. That's the last thing I'm doing. I'd rather do anything." He's, like, started throwing a fit. So I was like, "Can you think about Bubby and Zadie for one second?" And he goes, he pauses and he goes, "Yep, I thought about them. I'm still not going." [laughs] Well, they would probably... Your grandfather would probably prefer he watch the game, no? Oh my God. My... I don't... Yeah, probably. But my...

26:07I was just like, look at this kid, who has every privilege in the world, [laughs] can't be bothered going to a one-hour ceremony about Yom HaShoah. And like- Yeah... my grandparents were in the Shoah. But it was just funny. I mean, but, uh, okay, but, but here's the thing. Like, we weren't. Yes, exactly. We weren't. And even if we were, like, I, I think, and I don't know if this is true, but, like, think about the hostages that were released. Yeah. Six months ago, a year ago, whatever. Right.

26:33Do you think they're not still pissed off at little things that happen in their life just because- Of course... they were hostages? Right. Right. Yeah. Also, like, why would we torture our grandparents after they've been through hell to go to these events? Oh, I wouldn't force my grandparents to go. I would think don't go. No. If anything, Yom HaShoah for grandparents should be, like, a fun, like, you know- A fun day?... taking them to a water park or something. Like, just do fun things for them. I did a, um- Paragliding... I'm doing a...

26:59Paragliding. [laughs] Trigger warning. Um, I'm doing a... Do you know what Zikaron Basalon is? Sure. Yeah. It's the, the translation in English would be, like, me- memory in your living room. Yeah. Except it rhymes in Hebrew, so it's kinda cute. Yeah. Um, and it's a really amazing program where they will, um, take, uh, you sign up to host a Holocaust survivor, and they match you with a survivor. Yeah. So everybody should look it up. Um, it's called Zikaron Basalon. I'll put a link to it, if I remember. Um, and you can see if there's one near you. In fact, in Israel, it's really cute.

27:37My mom sent me, um, a screenshot from Waze, where, you know how W- like, Waze and Google Maps- Yeah, I can see... be, like, overlays of, like, restaurants or whatever, so you can see where there is one near you. Um, so I signed up to do one. Um, so I got matched with this woman who seems very lovely, and, uh, we're trying to figure out a date, and I, and we're like, "Okay, well, let's do April 20th." And [laughs] I don't know why. That's Hitler's birthday. Exactly. That was... [laughs] So I was like, "Oh. [laughs] That's Hitler's birthday."

28:10I know seven birthdays: my four children, my husband, myself, [laughs] and- And Hitler... and Hitler. [laughs] But thankfully- Horrible... she was like, uh, she thought that was funny. She was like, "Great." [laughs] Okay, I have something really horrible that I thought about. Should I say it? I can't decide. What you're, what, what you're getting Hitler for his birthday? No, it's horrible. Okay, when we were younger... I'm just gonna say it, 'cause I'm sure many people- We made people listen to seven minutes about love on the spectrum, so they, they've heard it. I know. I know. Okay.

28:39So when we were younger, like, Holocaust survivors would come and speak to us, and we had our own grandparents, obviously, both of us. And, like, my grandparents were married before the war. My grandfather had children. Like, they were full adults, right? Yeah. They went through hell. And we would meet these people with these incredible stories of, like, resilience and all this stuff. But I'm finding now that the Holocaust survivors that we encounter, most of them were- No, they were all babies... they were ba- [laughs] they were very young children. Yeah.

29:08And so it's a very different experience, you know, hearing, you know, someone's, who was a five-year-old or an eight-year-old. I'm not trying to, like, lessen their pain or their suffering. What you're, what you're saying- Chas ve'shalom... is you're ranking Holocaust survivors- I- [laughs]... by- I'm saying that it's very different, and I'm not... God forbid, I don't wanna rank anyone's pain, but it- Okay, but you just did. It's just, it's different. [laughs] No. [laughs] Do you not- It is diff- Do you not think it's different? I just think it's different.

29:36The storytelling aspect is different, for sure. It's just different. I, I hate to say it like that. And- Did I tell you about the time I, I was in college, and remember the film Europa, Europa? Yeah, of course. Um, everybody remember... I mean, not everybody, but, like, a lot of Jewish kids remember that film, because it was a very traumatic experience- Yeah... where the, the boy... It's about a Jewish boy who goes un- you know, into a Christian school, and there's a... scene where he's trying to reverse his circumcision. Yeah. Yeah.

30:05Um, so when I was in college, which was many years ago now, um, we had the guy come- Oh... to speak. Interesting. And, and he watched the film with us- Oh, wow... which was crazy. And he was heckling during the film. Oh my God. So he was making, you know, he was like making out with this German girl or, or, I forget where it was, Poland or Germany, and he wouldn't have sex with her because sh- you know, he wouldn't- Yeah... he wouldn't. So she was accusing him of, I don't know, being impotent, and he was yelling at the screen and being like, "I'm not." [laughs] Oh my God. I'm like, that- That's horrible... that is a top tier- Yes...

30:40Holocaust survivor experience. Exa- no, r- legitimate. Legitimate. Yeah. I, I heard a speaker once, I took my students actually, so this wasn't even that long ago, but maybe 15- maybe it was, like, 20 years ago, let's say, 'cause I took my, when I taught high school, so it's probably 20 years ago, and I took them to see a sp- hear a speaker, and she was a real Holocaust survivor, went through a bunch of camps, whatever. [laughs] And on the- You can't say real Holocaust survivor now [laughs] I don't mean it like that. But you know- I, I really hope the lady that's coming to my house is not gonna listen to this episode...

31:13she was, you know, she was in the camps, et cetera, and on the last day of the war, when the war was over, there was a group of American soldiers that- Mm-hmm... liberated her, and one of them was a Jewish guy from- Yeah... New York, and they- Was it her?... fell in love, and they got married- Wow. Aw... and had a family and lived together for, you know, 60 years. So it was like a b- I mean, what a story. That was like a b- and then she doesn't, you don't know it before, but she, like, tells the story, and then her husband comes on stage, and he was like- Aw.

31:41No, it was, you know me with my roma- I mean, giving a romantic story. I would be getting out of the, I would be getting out of the camp and being like, "Is anybody here Jewish?" [laughs] You would. "Is anybody here not married?" [laughs] She talks about how she [laughs] she talks about how her hair had, like, gone gray even though she was, like, 22 or whatever. I never thought of that, right? And then she, like, it was the first time I realized, she said, "I hadn't taken a shower in four years." Like- Oh...

32:11she had not had a shower in four years, which is good, 'cause the showers they were providing in the camps were- Yeah, that's smart... not showers. Yeah. Right. Exactly. But the point is, is that- And she's still got a man... those are beautiful stories. Yes. He fell in love with her, and they- Wow. I know. I know. It's a beautiful story. Ladies- There's hope... there are no more excuses. [laughs] Are there romances happening in this war? Probably not. 'Cause, like, we don't fight war like that anymore. Now it's all from airplanes and bombs. I don't know.

32:40You know, there are no, um- There are no soldiers... hostage couples that we know of. I don't think- Right... men and women were really held together. Right. Right. Um- Although I saw S- Sasha Troubonov, I think. Yeah. Uh, is that his name? He got engaged this weekend. Yeah. It was beautiful. Yeah. Yeah. A few people got engaged. And Noa Argamani and, um, what's his name broke up. I know. But I- Yeah... I'm not that surprised. I mean- Yeah... the guy poor guy... I mean, who knows, like, what you're going through. I don't- Well, and who knows what their relationship was before. I, I, we probably over-romanticized it the whole time.

33:12Like, maybe they were casual- Maybe... before. Yeah. No, no. Who knows? I think they were definitely a couple, but you never know, like, people's marriages and- Right. Right... you know, I, I thought about this through, a- and again, the last two and a half years have been crazy beyond belief, but I thought, you know, we'd, we'd hear a lot of spouses, y- you know, a- like, doing all this activism for their... And I'm like, what if a couple was really in a bad place? Not to say that they wouldn't fight- Yeah...

33:41for their person to come home, but, like, what if you're about to break up? What if you're... I don't know, there's just so many complexities- I, I know. I know... that you have, like human complexities. Right. Or like, what if your last conversation was a fight or what, you know, any of that stuff? But I think that- Yeah... all goes out the window. I try not to belie- I, I, I think about that sometimes- It's out the window... when I talk to somebody I care about and I'm maybe not very nice and I'm like, "What if that's our last conversation?" But I've convinced myself that it doesn't matter. [laughs] You know what? I'll tell you something.

34:07I was talking to a parent over Pesach who's struggling with an adult child, um, yeah, a young adult child, who's, like, giving them a really, really hard time and she's being really difficult and causing a lot of issues in the family, and he said to me, "My biggest fear right now is that I'm gonna drop dead, and she, it's gonna ruin her life because she's gonna feel so bad about how she's been treating me- Wow... over the last few years." And I, that broke my heart, you know? I just th- thought to myself- New fear unlocked. Yeah. Like, no- Yeah... it just, it broke my heart 'cause I was like, he... Uh, listen to a parent.

34:42What's he worried about? He's worried about his child suffering after he dies because of how she's been behaving. It's just so sad. Do you know many... I can think of three men that I know to various degrees who have cut off contact with their parents, um, who are maybe not perfect, but not- Yeah... like, abusive or not, you know... Um, do you see that a lot, people, like, cutting- Yeah... people off? Yeah. For reasons that aren't, like, s- fraud or I don't know what, like stealing money or- I mean, even fraud, I, I think my first thing is try to make it work.

35:20I mean, obviously, like, it's, uh, cutting off family is, I, I, I can't think of something more painful. I, I really can't. Well- It, it's-... if I put myself in the person's shoes, like, I would say, okay, let's say this relationship is only causing you pain, but- Right... still that's... Or Arthur Brooks would say. I don't know what he would say. Um, he would probably say something about Jesus 'cause he's very religious. What would you say? I would say that you have to face hard things and- Yeah...

35:47and sometimes maybe it is, maybe it's that toxic and terrible and nothing is coming out of it, but sometimes it's just other hardships, and we carry so much from our childhood into our, like, our relationship with our parents. And not everybody's very introspective. You know, not everybody can say, like, do you ever get this feeling where you're so angry at somebody who's close to you and you know... that you're 50% of the anger. Yeah. Of course. At le- you know. Right. So at least it gives you a little bit of perspective- Well-... like, this person is not awful. Right.

36:20I mean, look, i- it's hard to judge other people's situations, but- But it's really fun... I know, I... Yeah, it is fun. But I know for myself that, like, I have the me that's, like, warm and, and close, and you know, wants to tell everyone everything, and hear, listen to everyone's life stories, and give feedback. Like, I have that side of me with most people that I care about. And then there's the other side of me that's just, like, w- nice, you know? Gr- like, I can just be, like, uh, what's the word?

36:47You know, gracious and, and friendly, but not overly, like, you know, warm and, and not spilling my guts out to them, whatever. Like, when I meet someone at Trader Joe's in the, you know, the checkout line, I don't, like, start telling them my theories on Holocaust survivor, n- you know- [laughs] Which ones are better than others... out- which ones are better. Yeah. Do you know what I mean? Like, but I'm polite. Like, "Oh, what are you buying? Mixed nuts?" Yeah. [laughs] Listen, have you heard of this survivor that was five years old?

37:13[laughs] And she wasn't even in Germany or Poland. She doesn't remember anything. Exactly. She was in, like- Yeah... Belgium. She was in Romania. Yeah. No, but, like, but, but so my question to people who break off ties with their family is, like, why can't you be that person, the second person? Like, why can't you just be distant and polite, but still- Mm... show up for things, and still kind of, like, have contact in a polite way without totally cutting off parents or...

37:40I mean, siblings is different, 'cause if siblings hurt each other, you know, I, I don't know, the, every, I guess every case is different, but I think with parents for sure- Well, in your community you have so many siblings you could afford to- Yeah, but you know what pain-... knock down a few... it causes parents when two siblings don't talk or don't- Oh, yeah. I know... get along. It causes the parents tremendous amount of pain. So why can't people just be, like, polite to each other, and show up, and- I think it's harder... just move on. I think it's almost harder to be, like, proper and polite. Yeah, but, but it does- I don't know...

38:08so much for the family. If you really care about your greater family structure, like, you know, just even if it's hurting you, I think, like, we all sacrifice in different ways for different things. And I know it's easy for me to say, 'cause I don't ha- thank God I don't have that, but I have close people to me who don't get along with certain family members, or, or who have cut off certain family members, and I often wonder, like, what if you just, for the whatever time period you have to be around them, if you could sort of just pretend you're, like, at Trader Joe's, and it's all just nice and polite and- You know what you need?

38:42You need a good s-... gossip... a good spouse or, or a good sibling to gossip with about them. Right. Afterwards, yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Exactly. All right, well- But I don't know. Maybe I'm wrong about that... stupid life advice from Yael HaYeleh. [laughs] Rule number one: make up with your parents. Rule number two- Yes... don't be a Holocaust survivor without experience. [laughs] Oh my God. Can we talk about- It's true... we didn't talk about Iran at all. I know. Aside from trying to send Steve Witkoff to lav a specter. Iran, what are we gonna do about Iran? It's, um, I'm, you know, this war was really, uh, it was not my, it was not my best war. No. It's not my favorite war. Right. Like, the 12 Day War was easier to handle. It was fun, yeah. Then we had... Yeah. It was, this is- This wasn't fun. I don't, you know.

39:23No, no, no. But, right, it was different. This is, this has been really tough. I, I cannot say enough how, how badly I feel for the Israelis. I just, I can't- Everyone in Israel, like, um- I cannot stop thinking about it. Like, they don't catch a break, and it's, it's... Everyone I talk to in Israel, it's just they're exhausted, they, their kid now... I mean, kids went back to school this week, but now who knows? As of this morning, it sounds like the war is gonna resume, so are they gonna cancel school again? I think people are hoping that the war will resume.

39:52It's- Yeah... it's so hard to explain this to Americans. Like- I know, I know... they don't understand that Israelis are some of the most peace-loving people I know. I know. And they are disappointed that this war ended- Right... because they want to- Finish it... live in peace. Yeah. And they don't wanna be in this situation again and again. And look, there are people whose entire, whose kids, who have toddlers- Mm-hmm... whose entire life has been war. Yeah. Yeah. Um, you know. Yeah. And, and add COVID on top of that, and you have- Right...

40:21like, kids whose entire life- Yeah... have been COVID and then war. Right. Um, it's, it's just really disheartening. It's disheartening how it's been dealt with here. Um, you know, a lot of people are obviously very unhappy because the Americans don't like war, it seems. Um, but also they don't see the immediate threat because it's something more like, oh, Iran having nukes is, like, something more... It, i- it doesn't feel like- Yeah... it affects them.

40:49It definitely doesn't affect them as much as it affects Israelis. But it's been all very, just very disheartening. You really feel like i- if you're supportive of the war, if you're supportive of, it makes you, like, a MAGA crazy Trump person. Yeah. And I'm like, "No, I'm not." And also, like, do you know how many people in Israel, like, hate Netanyahu and are incredibly supportive of the war? And part of the reason they hate Netanyahu is 'cause he doesn't finish things. Yeah.

41:21And y- here it's just so, I don't know, it's so, people can be so, like, privileged, and it's all, like, I was telling, I was, got upset at somebody the other day, and I was like, "It must be fun for this just to be a game for you." Right. Right. 'Cause it's a game for- Or a political issue... a political issue. Yeah. Like, it's, for me, it's my life. Right. Um. Right. So, and then the other thing... Oh, sorry, what were you gonna say? No, no, no.

41:46Go ahead. I'll f- I'll save it. Uh, well, the other thing that I found to be really crazy right now, and I don't know how to say this, but... So you know how people here have Trump Derangement Syndrome, right? Yeah. Um, in Israel, people have Bibi Derangement Syndrome. Right. And do all the throat clearing, don't like Bibi, would love to see him get unseated. Unseated? Deseated? Yeah, unseated. Um, n- never voted for him, never will. But the thing with these derangement syndromes is you see the world solely through the actions of this one person. Right. And nobody else has any agency. Right.

42:24So you talk to Israelis, and they'll tell you things, and you, you're like, "You sound like Tucker Carlson." [laughs] And these are Zionist Israelis- Right... who love Israel and want- Right... Israel to win this war. And they're like, "Bibi convinced Trump to do this, and he, like, you know, he sold this to him." And I'm like, "Well, of course Bibi went and advocated for this. I would expect him to as a leader of a nation." Of course. You go to your allies, and you try to get them on board. But, like, does Trump not have any say in this? How about the Iranians or Hezbollah? Right. Are they not a player?

43:00Like, everything has to start and end with Netanyahu or Trump's decisions, and people forget that there are other players in this field. So you don't have to like them. You just have to- Right... like recognize that they are a factor of what else is going on. Yeah. I'll say two things. First of all, being Orthodox, and especially ultra Orthodox, like in the Haredi circles, even though I'm not exactly Haredi, but adjacent, Haredi adjacent, it really- Can I... I, I have to say something mean. Yeah.

43:31You have a lot more time to think about this, 'cause you're not serving in the army. Okay, sorry. [laughs] Oh. Oh, 'cause you are right now. Oh. No. [laughs] I was your- I was at- [laughs] I was your- I'm way too old. I'm too old. I've aged out of reserve duty, okay? Oh. I'll have you know. No, no, no. I am a Holocaust survivor myself. [laughs] If the IDF would allow me to join, I would. I said it the day I... I said it on October 7th. [laughs] I will come and fight. Give me a gun and put me in the war. I'll do it. [laughs] They would look at me and start laughing if they saw.

43:59Anyway, uh, no, I was gonna say about- They'd probably kidnap you, and they're like, "Nah, it's not worth it." Yeah. [laughs] Exactly. No, but what I was gonna say is about being religious, Orthodox, whatever, Haredi, is you learn not to care at all what anyone thinks. Oh, boy. And that bothered me. That bothered me a lot in my life, because I'm adjacent, right? I live in both worlds. I do care what people think about me. As I'm getting older, and especially since October 7th, I'm really leaning into that instinct, which is like, people don't understand. They are stupid. I'm sorry. I'm being very...

44:33I'm gonna be extremely obnoxious right now. People don't get it. They don't know enough. They don't understand the history. They don't understand the region. They don't understand the players. They don't understand what's happening, and so they don't understand. Now, I'm not saying that Israelis... I, I, I don't live there. I don't... I'm not dealing with it every day. Israelis can believe whatever they want. They're in it. They're on the ground, Cola Kavod.

44:57But American Jews who go, especially the ones who are public-facing, okay, and say things like what I saw yesterday, what's that idiot from the All In podcast, Jason blah blah, whatever his name is. Ugh. When he goes on there and he says, "Every Jew..." I quote you. He said, "Every Jew I talk to says that Bibi is causing antisemitism to rise in the United States." Fuck you, okay? Mm-hmm. Sorry. You are an idiot. I do not care what you think. You don't know the Jewish community. You don't know what's going on. You don't understand geopolitics. You don't understand the history of Israel. You don't understand Jewish history.

45:32Shut up, okay? You wanna talk about the war, and you wanna have a different opinion, and you wanna believe that maybe Trump did it wrong, or, or maybe he shouldn't have done it, or Bibi this, fine. I don't care. But to s- make a statement like that, that every Jew you know believes that Bibi is causing antisemitism to rise here in the United States, what the hell? I'm sorry. I... A lot of Jews believe that. That's where my Haredi side comes out, and I say- A lot of Jews believe that... all of these people are nonsense and useless idiots. That's all. Oh, yeah. First of all, a lot of Jews believe that.

46:02B, I think Bibi sometimes d- is not helping with antisemitism, but again, that's not my g- Like, between... I was... I retweeted something Peter Meijer said yesterday about, who's I'm becoming, like, a huge fan of. Um- Yeah... Peter Meijer was a congressman and now does, like- He was a congressman. He was a congressman, yeah. Yeah. And now he's on TV a lot, and he's a military veteran, um, and he's a, he's a, a friend of, of our friends, so I feel like- [laughs]... he's part of the, part of our universe. He's our best friend.

46:32Um, he's our best friend. He's here right now, actually. [laughs] Um, he, you know, we talk about hearts and minds and hearts and minds and, like, none of that worked, and, like... A- and I tweeted something. I retweeted. I said, like, "You know what? I, h- like, you know, I know a lot about wanting to be liked," right? I walk around all day- Yeah... being like- I-... "Do you like me? Do you like me? Are you mad at me?" [laughs] But surviving is more important to me- Yeah, exactly... than being liked. So again, not saying Bibi is perfect, not saying that, that Bibi isn't, you know...

47:02W- would it be better if we had a really nice fluffy guy? Um, sure. If that guy was putting being liked in front of our security interests, then no, that would not be. Right. Exactly. Exactly. So... And, and saying that is just like... And, and again, a lot of Israelis say what, what Jason, or whatever the fuck his name is, and all these tech bros who think that because they know how to make money- Yeah... they also know other things. Exactly. Um, you know, it's just so, like, shortsighted. Right. And it's... You're, you're, like, taking away agency from everybody else in this game. Yeah. Right? Yeah.

47:36And, and you know what? With... People talk about antisemitism, but it never... They never talk about what's underneath the surface of it. So no, saying Bibi sucks is not antisemitic. Exactly. But how many people do you see who say, "Bibi sucks," and also Israel controls America? [laughs] Like, give me a break. Exactly. You know? Exactly. But, but it's terrible, because I see Israelis starting to sound like that too. Right. And they also can't see, like, anything. Like, n- nobody else in the region has leadership. Nobody else in the region has goals.

48:11Right. And, and I get why they're frustrated. Israel is very... Israelis are very frustrated with- What, first and foremost what happened on October 7th. Yeah. Right? Yeah. They're frustrated that the country failed. The country really failed. All right? Mm-hmm. The, the, the leadership, the IDF, the intelligence, whatever. Between that and, like, throwing all the blame on them is... s- that's something Israelis know how to make that differ- differential. Right. Right They know, like, yeah, f- like, we blame our government, but, like, of course we blame Hamas. Right.

48:46People here a lot of times don't know how to do that. Right. And they blame both sides equally. Right. And that is very stupid. Someone wrote, I saw a tweet like, "Oh, I wonder how Israelis feel knowing that everyone hates them," and someone retweeted it [laughs] and wrote, "Feels a lot better than standing in line for gas chambers," so. [laughs] Like, that I know. Yeah, yeah. And also- You know, but I have to say, I am kind of, I am kind of... I don't know. I, I don't like when people are like, "Those are our two options."

49:16Uh, uh- Yeah, well, sometimes it is. But- Sometimes it is. Yeah, well, but it- Israel's in a very tough spot. It's in a c- how could anybody- Well, that doesn't have to be as bad as gas chambers. No, it does bad. It can be as bad as kids in northern Israel having 12 sirens a day with zero warning- Exactly... because they're half a mile- Exactly... from the border. Exactly. And growing up in a, in a fucking war, like a real war zone, okay? Yeah. The kind that you see in movies where bombs are falling all the time. Yeah. At what point do you say, "Enough"? Mm.

49:46I saw a guy, if we're, if we're, if we're just opening up on everyone now. If we went after Holocaust survivors, I wanna go after this guy. [laughs] I saw, I don't remember his name, but he was a hostage in 1979 in Iran. Yeah. Okay? Sorry that happened to you. [laughs] Wrote this whole thing. Sorry. And, and again, you know- Are you about to say, "Sorry, not sorry"? Go on. Sor- no. I mean, it also doesn't mean that you... Yeah, you know a lot about what happened to you, but doesn't mean- Right... that you're- You understand everything.

50:14And he wrote this whole thing about, oh, Trump, whatever, and then he said, and then he had a throwaway line in there, and he said, "And the Israelis, who nobody even invited to this." Oh. Like, are you fucking kidding me? Oh, that's cute. Can I show you- That's cute... like, bombed out towns in northern Israel? Can I show you entire families who've been killed because they were invited to this by Hezbollah and by Iran? How about the fact that, I forgot who wrote an article this weekend, but it was a really good one, about how the f- the fact that Iran spent the last 30, 40 years, uh, deeply dividing the Palestinians and Israelis, ha- taking a vested interest in there not being peace, right? Mm-hmm. And if they would've not nixed their nose in and would not have built up Hamas and would not- Mm...

50:59have built up Hezbollah, the whole Middle East could have looked different today. So forget- Yeah... anything else. How about that? No, everything that happened is because of the- The problem is they don't get it. They don't get it. They don't understand. They just don't understand. It's a very weird, like, instinct. I don't know. It's a very weird instinct to constantly look at... Maybe it's like, okay, hear me out here. You know that thing where you bump into somebody, somebody bumps into you on the street? Somebody bumps into you on the street. Like physically? What do you do? Yeah. Like actually bumps into you?

51:28Accidentally, but somebody, it's definitely their fault. What do you do? What's the first thing that comes out of your mouth? Sorry. Sorry, right? Yeah. I think there's some instinct there of, like- Yeah... bad things are happening. People are doing bad things to me. Let's look inward. Yeah. Yeah. And it, it's not a bad instinct, right? No. It's like, it, it, th- there's, like, something good about that, but, like- You're-... to the point of, like- Well, you're describing-... actually, no, I'm good here...

51:53you're actually describing a very Jewish idea, which is when bad things are happening to Jewish people, what's the first thing we're supposed to do? I'm gonna get very religious on you right now. No, it's fine. The first thing we're supposed to do is- [laughs] I know... is to look inward and say, "What are we doing wrong? Where are we s- you know, what sins are we doing? Let's improve in Torah and Mitzvot. Let's increase in this. Let's incre- " That is, like, the first Jewish instinct that happens, and th- I mean, religiously, I'm saying. And then you deal with the other part of it.

52:21Now, when you do that, which I was raised, right? Something's wrong, like the Beit HaMikdash was destroyed, the temple was destroyed because why? I was always taught it was destroyed because of Sinat Chinam. The Jews hated each other. They were fighting. Oh, well we're doing great now, by the way, with that. One minute. Yeah. Wait. Let me finish my thought. I resented that. I resented that. I'm like, wait. What do you mean? The de- Beit HaMikdash was destroyed 'cause the Romans destroyed it, uh, or the Babylonians, the first Beit HaMik- Like, don't sit here and tell me, like you're victim-blaming, right? I f- Right...

52:50I saw it as a form of victim-blaming. But actually, we do this really interesting thing in Judaism where we say, "No, no, no. Both things are correct," right? One, let's look at ourselves. What could we be doing better? How could we increase in goodness and kindness? How could we treat each other better? How could we fix our own, fix up our own house, right, and make sure that we're doing what Hashem wants or, or what should do- Yeah... whatever. We're, we're, we're cle- we're clearly- And-... learned our lessons... right Yeah. And, and at the same exact time, and 100% the same, to the same degree, it's the other person's fault, right?

53:26It's the Romans, the Babylonians, Hamas, Iran, whatever, right? It's, it could be both. I'm fi- like, and I- Yeah, but nobody's going around-... nobody's a children-... and writing op-eds for The New York Times- Exactly... about how the Romans had no choice because the Jews- Exactly... hated each other so much. Exactly. Like, you know. Right. F off. He's gonna get mad at me- Correct... 'cause I'm screaming and it's not good for the audio. I know, but no, that's exactly right.

53:48I don't need Glenn Greenwald writing articles about how the Babylonians were really just trying to build a one nation state for everyone. Yeah. Yeah. Like, go fly a kite, okay? Go away. Yeah, and maybe if the Jews didn't exist at all, the Babylonians wouldn't be so angry. Yeah, [laughs] exactly. That sounds like something Glenn Greenwald would say. And also- He would be, say it a lot meaner. No, he's... I hate him. Anyway, aside from that, it's like, and here we go. I'm sorry, I wasn't gonna mention Mandy Patinkin, but this is the- Oh, boy... this is the Mandy- Give me four minutes.

54:20No, this is the Mandy Patinkin syndrome where I'm gonna... trot out my Jewish identity when it suits me to make money and to write as a Jew, as a Jew. I'll make albums in Yiddish, and I'll perform Jewish things, and then I will turn around, and I will stab the Jewish people right in the heart. You know what? I, we see you. We see exactly who you are. I know you. Were you in line picking up matzah like I was for an hour and 20 minutes in my car, in my van, in a line full of minivans? [laughs] Okay, on Erev Pesach? No.

54:54Were you doing, were you collecting tzedakah, charity, for all the families who have no, uh, uh, no livelihood right now in Israel, so everyone's sending money for Passover so that Jews in Israel could buy matzah and wine and celebrate Passover even though they haven't been to work for six weeks? No. So Matthew Potakin and all the people like him, you could shut your mouths. Not interested in what you have to say about the Jewish world. Sorry. Have a good life. [laughs] Okay? Yeah, but, but they can. They can.

55:24They can get away with it. There's, we talked about- No, there's no free speech in Judaism... this Rabbi, Rabbi Wolpe a little bit. W- you can do that today. You, we live in a- You really can... in a wonderful country, in a wonderful era- Right... and you can survive and thrive while throwing everybody else under the bus. Right. And I don't think they're doing it intentionally. I think they're just choosing to see what they wanna see. It's sad. I feel sad for them. I raised my, my four sons- Feel sad for us.

55:51No, I raised my four sons to be proud and strong and to think and to look at the world critically and, but with, with pride, not as s- Jews running away and, and, and trying to kiss up to our enemies. Never. Never, ever, ever. My kids know that we belong where we are. We belong here in the United States. We belong in Israel. We belong wherever we are in the world. We have every right to be where we are. We have nothing to apologize for, nothing to be ashamed of.

56:18Not that there aren't things that we could improve, and not that our government in Israel shouldn't get better, and I, again, I would support a, you know, a new prime minister who was worthwhile. I mean, all of it. I mean, I, I have no problem with that. And we have deep issues we've discussed many times on the podcast about between the Orthodox and non, and between, whatever, all the other issues, left and right, young and old, everything, diaspora and Israel.

56:40We have a lot of issues, but never ever would I apologize for who we are and what we are. Never. Not one- It's-... minute of my life... it, it, to me, it's about extending grace. So y- you know, people will extend that grace to every enemy that we have, but never- Yeah... to ourselves. Never to- It's s- ugh, it's so blatant. Come on. It's blatant and, and it's also- It's so blatant the way they kiss up. They love the Muslims now. Oh, all these, they love, oh, everyone's great in the Islamic world. There's no such thing as Islamic jihadism anymore.

57:11No, Israel's the great big ba- the great big- Well, listen... come on. I'm okay with that if you do that across the board, which people never do. Yeah. Right? Exactly. If you extend that grace to everyone, and if you ask yourself why a, a Muslim, uh, blows themselves up in a bus and what kind of problems he had or what kind of things led him to do that, you then also ask yourself that about a settler that lights up a- Yeah, of course... Palestinian village. And you know what I think- Of course... about, I am, I equally despise both of those people. Like, I am, both those people, I don't give a fuck, sorry, what led them to do what they did.

57:48I really don't care. I think they need to be stopped. Yeah. Okay, but- And you either extend it to both sides or you don't at all, but you can't just pick and choose who the good terrorists are and the bad terrorists. Okay, fine. We won't get into that, but yes. W- what, what, what were you gonna say? Don't, don't. W- we won't get into it. Okay. We can talk about it next episode. You're just gonna say, "Oh, but then they stole their sheep, blah, blah, blah, blah." No, I'm not say- I'm not defending them. I just- Okay... that's not, to me, s- not the same, but- Well, it's not the same-...

58:19I see a difference... but it's not part of our- Yeah, who's, who's-... governing principles... exactly. Who's pointing that- It's not part of our... No, no. Oh, in, in scale- Yeah... in, in how society treats them, of course it's not the same. Right. But I'm saying, like, I, you know, the consistency- It's like treating someone that comes to a party with a cold the same as someone who comes to a party with measles and starts throwing up on you. What? Where? Like...

58:43[laughs] That is the weirdest analogy I've ever heard in my life. [laughs] I know. Unbelievable. That has nothing to do with anything. [laughs] Yeah, like a cold, a cold is annoying, and it ba- and people could get sick from it, fine, but someone who comes with measles [laughs] causes everyone to die. But if you were me, I think both the person with the cold and the person with the measles should be in prison. [laughs] That's, that's really what it comes down to. There you go. Yeah.

59:14That's, that's, that's our difference. Yeah. [laughs] That's where we differ. You know I'm very pro-incarceration, so. [laughs] I think that it, I think like the Batman movie that everybody should start their life in prison and work their way out. Oh my God. Like the movie with Bane. That's terrible. You know? Show that you're willing to be a m- m- functioning member of society. That's the opposite of Jewish philosophy and Hasidic philosophy. We're all born good. We're not... Christians believe everyone's evil.

59:39No, we are born good. Yeah, maybe I'm a Christian. No, you're not, okay? You're a Jew. I'm part Jewish- You have a neshamah... I'm Christian. You have a pentela yid, a neshamah in your heart, okay? You, we believe everyone's good. Everyone is good. Is it hard to be a Christian? No, it's so much easier than being Jewish. Are you kidding? Really? Oh my God. I, I mean, you trade Saturdays, Sundays for Saturdays. They eat, like, chocolate eggs while we were eating real eggs and matzah. [laughs] Okay? Couldn't go- That's true... couldn't go to the bathroom for 10 days. And then do an Easter hunt.

1:00:08Like, what do we have that's even close to an Easter egg hunt? [laughs] We have no games. [laughs] We have no games. What, dreidel? Dreidel, really? Dreidel. [laughs] Dreidel is so fun. It's so fun. Oh my God. I've never... You know what? That's what people need to do instead of being on their phone. They just need to play dreidel. Oh my God. All day. Anyway Okay, last thing and then I gotta go. You got me into playing this game, which I, if you know me, you know I don't like games Oh. I don't play games. I'm not a game person Yeah I don't li- I never did Wordle, maybe for a week.

1:00:41I, I have no patience for games. But- Crossplay... you got me into this game called Crossplay. Yeah. It is such nonsense. These are not words. No, you're just very bad at it. [laughs] No, no, no. I ha- I am really bad at it. I can't win a game because these are made up words. You literally make up words all day. Yeah. They're not words. That's, that's how you play. You make up words and you press, that sound like words, and you keep pressing and trying them until one of them is correct. Yeah, but... Oh, that's how you do it? Yeah. Oh. That's- Oh, I'm gonna- But that's...

1:01:10Listen, this is a very- Oh... there's a very Talmudic lesson here for you. You just k- have to keep experimenting and trying, and do things that don't make sense sometimes. [laughs] Okay, I'm gonna try. Because once in a while you'll hit a 47-point word. Okay, I'm gonna try. Yeah. I'm gonna try. I'm gonna experiment. If I- If any of our listeners wanna play Crossplay with us, come to the Substack chat. Yeah, yeah. We'll play against, I'll play against anyone. Yeah. I think you're bad. I beat Chaya La very easily 'cause she didn't study languages. No, 'cause I look for actual words, and I end up writing- Is she not?...

1:01:41it because- In seminary she didn't, she c- she can recite the, the Talmud, but she doesn't know vowels. Oh. Um, and I, who English is my second language, am, I'm quite good. But we still have our friends, uh, our friends Benji and Bill always kick my butt. Alyssa, who I'm convinced is cheating because she wins every game. So Alyssa, I'm onto you. She uses really good words. Um- It helps that she's multilingual, I believe. Yeah. She speaks English, Hebrew, and Russian, right? Yeah. Minimum. That's cheating. Maybe others, maybe others languages. That's cheating. Mm-mm.

1:02:15You can't know that many languages. Do you ever watch that guy, Yuji? I'm obsessed with that guy. No. He goes around, he speaks, like, every language. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. He stops people on the street, and he's like, "I speak your language." And then they're like, "No, you don't." And he's like, "Yes, I do." And they're like, "I'm from Burkina Faso," which I have to Google every time if, where that is. And then he speaks their language. It's crazy. There's, um- I think you can only speak English. There's a podcast.

1:02:41So speaking of obsessions, I'll just do another recommendation. Well, I'll do two recommendations. Okay. Um, there's a podcast that I'm obsessed with now, and I really wanna get him on our show. Um, it's called What's Going on With Shipping? Oh, yeah. You told me. And I- Let's get him... so I feel like I am very slowly morphing into a middle-aged man because I went from watching World War I and World War II documentaries every night to being absolutely obsessed with this podcast that's about international shipping, and, like, how we get our Amazon packages and things like that.

1:03:14And now is his, like, time to shine because of Hormuz. So it's really interesting, uh, it's called What's Going on With Shipping. It's really big. I didn't, like, you know, I didn't invent this podcast. Um, and then have you watched the Netflix documentary about the Mormon sex cult? No, but you told me about it. Okay, you have to watch it so we can talk about it. It is, like, somebody created, it's like an algorithm created a documentary for Yael because it has all the things I like. Oh, my God. Mormons- That sounds yummy... cults, and sex. [laughs] I mean...

1:03:47I'm so happy for you. I, it really was beau- I'm, I'm just sad that it's over. Um, not the cult. I have to- I'm happy the cult's over Where, where did you watch it? I'm trying to write it down 'cause I know- Um, I think it's on Netflix. Mm-hmm. Okay, I'll find it. Um, I also watched, there's another good documentary about, um, chess that's really interesting about the guy who supposedly, um- Oh... uh, s- oh, it's called Trust Me: The False Prophet. It's on Netflix. Okay. The guy is not even hot, okay? Okay. Um- Wow... the leader.

1:04:19But yeah, which shows he's a r- he's probably really good. But, um, the chess documentary, remember that story about the guy who was accused of cheating with anal beads? No. Um- What? Yeah, there was a guy like a year ago- I don't even know what any of that sentence just meant [laughs] So there was a guy who was accused of cheating in chess with, by using, like, vibrating anal beads. Um- What? And I'm sor- this is, you know- Thankfully no one's listening at this point. I, 'cause I have no idea- No, your par-... what you're talking about... your parents are definitely listening.

1:04:49No, hopefully not, 'cause I don't know what you're saying. Um, anyway, it's a really good documentary. It's about all this, like, cheating scandal. Everybody in it is crazy- Mm... because they're all chess masters. And I don't know anything about chess, really. I don't even know how to play, like, rudimentary chess, and I think if you do, it's probably even more fascinating. Wow. So- Well-... everybody go watch that... my son, one of my sons, I won't say who, he had a birthday recently, and he asked us for his birthday if he could get a subscription to chess.com because- Oh... you can analyze your games. He plays chess.com all day.

1:05:23So I was thinking about you- But he-... because I remember you told me that your sons are on chess.com, and they get a lot of antisemitism. Yes, they do. So the big, like, the main characters in this documentary are the two founders of chess.com. Oh, really? Who are both really cute, actually. Oh, I wanna watch it. Yeah. But he, um, yeah, he, uh, what's it called? So we did, and he loves it, and he says he, like, you can analyze every game and what you could've done- Yeah... differently or what would've been a better move.

1:05:48So you sh- ask him if you watch it 'cause this whole, this guy, the anal beads guy- [laughs]... he rose to fame on chess.com. Oh, my God. Yeah. I hope my son does not know what those words mean or that they go together. Oh, he 100% knows. No, I'm not telling him about that. Text him right now- I am not telling him about this, ugh, words... what do the words anal beads mean to you. I- And he will immediately tell you about this chess player. That is absolutely never going to be something- Can I text him? I, absolutely not. [laughs] That is never going to be something I'm asking my son. Okay.

1:06:16And with that, have a good day. [laughs] Good day to you. Have a good day. All right. Um, have a lovely- Ooh... uh, rest of your weekend. You too. Mazel tov for The Fifth Column that's celebrating 10 years today. Mm-hmm. Yes. Uh, you know, bekol ovitzlano, as we say. One day- Amen, amen... one day in Jerusalem. Okay. Talk to you later. All right. Bye. Bye. [upbeat music]