The Botched and the Beautiful

0:04SPEAKER_01:Hi Angelo.

0:06SPEAKER_00:Hi Ramon. What? I'm just laughing about the allegations.

0:15SPEAKER_02:Which ones?

0:17SPEAKER_00:Um, everybody in the comments being like, uh you guys have had so much work done. Your forehead doesn't move, especially towards you. I don't know why.

0:30SPEAKER_01:My forehead's very my forehead's very expressive.

0:32SPEAKER_00:Yeah, everybody seems to be like, oh, like, you're so Botoxed up. So I wanted to ask you, I wanted to put you on the record. What have you had done?

0:43SPEAKER_01:I have never had an invasive procedure necessarily. I got Botox three years ago. A very slight amount in my forehead. Dr. Christine Hall in London. Um, she was a really, really great doctor in that knowing it was my first time getting anything done, she was like, We're gonna, we're gonna go baby steps. I'm gonna be very subtle with this. So she did very light Botox in my forehead. I wanted lip filler. I wanted lip filler so bad. And she would not, she would not overdo it at all.

1:15SPEAKER_01:Even though I was like, Mama, I wanna um because like having a mustache, your top lip just always looks a lot smaller. Oh. So that's why I wanted lip filler. And then um I did get under eye PDRN.

1:27SPEAKER_00:Oh, in London?

1:29SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I got two rounds of that, and actually, I didn't think it necessarily did a lot. My husband, he was like, No, I see like a big difference. For me, it's um out here, I feel like it's a little bit concave. And I think uh after the second session, it actually did smoothen fill out like that area really well.

1:44SPEAKER_00:Yeah, uh, everything that I've heard about like these PDRN injections, it seems that uh people are saying from their experience, at least my patients who have gotten it done, that it's something you need to repeat several times to really see any sort of change.

2:01SPEAKER_01:They I was told three rounds.

2:02SPEAKER_00:Yeah, versus like, you know, some of these people are going to Korea and just getting it done once and then they're like, it didn't do anything.

2:11SPEAKER_01:Also, they're getting like the in Korea, I think what's more popular is a very superficial all over the face version of it where I got like very deep, like cannula, needle all the way to the uh tear trough, um, that kind of PDRI injection.

2:24SPEAKER_00:Okay.

2:25SPEAKER_01:Yeah. But what's funny is again, when it comes to a good doctor, I was like, I want under-eye filler. And she was like, you don't. Here, what do you want? What are you what are your desired outcomes? Okay, based off that, I actually recommend this instead. Here's before and afters, and I was like, Oh, great, perfect.

2:40SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it interestingly, everybody like thinks that under-eye filler is the answer for every under-eye concern and the architecture of that area. I know it's a small area, but it is so complex, and there's so many different things that could be going on. So, under-eye filler is not the answer for everyone necessarily. Um, and I know from experience, so I guess that's a good segue to what I've had done. Um, being somebody who is a cosmetic dermatologist and works in this industry, I have access to like everything.

3:21SPEAKER_00:Um and I think that for a lot of people, it's a good idea to have a good amount of stuff done if you're performing the procedures, just because you want to know what it feels like. Um, even like a lot of the procedures that we do that like we typically numb people for, I'll do them without numbing just to know how it feels. A lot of y'all are babies. That's what I could tell you from my experience. Grow up, grow up. Okay, so um, gotta start at the beginning.

3:50SPEAKER_00:So botulinum toxin, various different brands. Um, I'll do it on average like every six months, and I've been doing that for the past eight years. Um, I think if anything has made me, you know, maintain my youthful appearance, it's been that um for the most part, just because I had really deep expression lines in my forehead. Um, and it was aging me. I actually felt like when I went from uh my first year out of medical school, I did internal medicine in a hospital because that's what you have to do in dermatology.

4:29SPEAKER_00:Um, and I was haggard. And then I started my derm residency and I looked haggard and then kind of did the transformation. I feel like I de-aged like five years. Um, other things that I've done, various different fillers. So as I was alluding to the under-eye, I did fill, I do have a little bit of a trough more on one side than the other, but I ended up dissolving it just because it swelled a little too much for me. It didn't look like I had a pouch because I was very conservative, but I did feel like it made my eyes look smaller.

5:07SPEAKER_00:So I just dissolved it, and I was like, okay, whatever I got going on is better than that. Um, I had my lips filled a few times, also dissolved that.

5:20SPEAKER_01:I remember those days. Do you was that early content for you? Did you have them? No. I feel like I remember you with a little moment.

5:28SPEAKER_00:At some t at some point, but yeah, dissolve that. Um jawline filler, chin filler. Chin filler will change your entire face. I think people don't realize the power of a good chin.

5:39SPEAKER_01:Girl, I shaved off my beard a couple months back. I didn't realize I had my dad's chin. I had an emotional breakdown. I literally called him in the bathroom and I was like, I did something horrible. So bad. So I I feel you on that one. I'd get it. Poor dad. Hi, Pa. Love you.

5:58SPEAKER_00:Uh, I've had like two chemical peels. The first one I had done, I actually got a chemical burn. Uh which ones did you do? Uh, so the one that I got a chemical burn from is a Jezners peel. So it's like a classic mixture of different like peeling actives, and it's a superficial chemical peel. I also did a VI peel once, which is not very intense, and we offer that at my practice. Um, and then a lot of energy-based devices. So your fave? Yeah. Um, I'm kind of like a laser nerd, but so I've had IPL, clear and brilliant.

6:41SPEAKER_00:Um, I do a lot of Pico laser on myself now, a lot of laser genesis. I've had Arrow Laze, um, and then other energy-based devices like RF, uh, so Zerf.

6:57SPEAKER_01:Your other favorite?

6:58SPEAKER_00:It's gotta come up every now and again. And that's everything that I've done on my face.

7:03SPEAKER_01:What about the body?

7:05SPEAKER_00:The body. I have done in the past a lot of M sculpt Neo. So uh it was it was more popular a few years ago. So M Sculpt is this uh basically like it runs electric current through your muscles. Um, so you could use it for uh toning different areas. I was doing it on my abs, and M Sculpt Neo actually includes radio frequency too for skin tightening and fat reduction. I've also had on my body um other radio frequencies. So I had TrueSculpt ID, which is uh kind of like these static pods that they put on.

7:45SPEAKER_00:I've done um both Zerf and this other RF device called density on my abdomen. I've injected my abdomen with Cybella as well. So those are fat-dissolving injections.

7:59SPEAKER_01:Do you recommend?

8:01SPEAKER_00:You know what? Okay, here's the deal with Cybella. It's FDA approval is for submental fat, but people use it in other areas. So, like uh fat that people get over like the bra and the back, people like to use it for that, or you know, other areas where like you have a small pouch of fat. It hurts like a bitch. Um, you do have to do it multiple times, uh, and not everybody's the right candidate for it. So I've heard from a lot of people that say, Well, I had it done and I feel like it did nothing.

8:35SPEAKER_00:It's for fat reduction, it does not tighten skin. And it has to be repeated multiple times for best results. Some people just end up saying, Oh, for this little area, I'll just get liposuction and be done in one shot, which valid. So, I mean, it's all about being the right candidate. Um, I do feel like it made a big difference on my abdomen, though. I'm one of those people that like I could lose and lose and lose and lose weight, and I'd still have like a tiny little pooch, and it's smaller now.

9:10SPEAKER_01:Okay, so I've done nothing on the body. Clearing the air right now. The BBL allegations are crazy. This body's natural, mommy. Body by Boricwa.

9:21SPEAKER_00:Okay, yeah. Some people just naturally have a fatty, okay?

9:25SPEAKER_01:Slim thick. No, I um I haven't done anything body related yet. I'm still young, body's still fairly tight. I'm not opposed to it though. But it's like it's interesting. It's like the approach to when I was a kid, I loved plastic surgery shows. Oh. And being from Florida, um, I feel like it's very culturally ingrained in Florida. But um, I remember watching so many things about guys getting like pec implants and different, like weird, not weird, sorry, different muscle uh enhancing implants and all that for like better physiques.

10:00SPEAKER_00:I oh, I will never forget MTV True Life.

10:05SPEAKER_01:Yes.

10:05SPEAKER_00:True life. I'm getting plastic surgery, and there was a guy on there that got calf implants.

10:10SPEAKER_01:I'm sorry, but a meaty calf that does something for me.

10:13SPEAKER_00:It's one of those muscles also that like a lot of people have a very hard time growing. So wow, blast from the past right there. I don't know why that came back to my memory, but that's kind of an obscure procedure to get done. It's not super common to get calf implants.

10:29SPEAKER_01:It's a lot of really fascinating ones. I remember um, I mean, we've talked about this in the show. Like, I've been watching drag race for like centuries. Um, Detox, season five, was very candid about all the stuff that they've gotten done because they're like 99% plastic. Um, but they got pec implants so that when they were in drag, push them together, and it really gave like boob.

10:49SPEAKER_00:Um, funny enough, I was at the Robin concert the other day, and at one point in the concert, so cool central. So cool.

11:00SPEAKER_01:Literally, everyone I know that went to that was like 35 and over gay.

11:04SPEAKER_00:Well, when I was there, I was like, hello millennials, hello gays, hello gay millennials. Everybody was there. But anyway, toward the end of the show, when she's doing dancing on my own, they like pan the entire front row of the audience and they're going across all these people, and then suddenly you just see detox, and I'm like, detox during this quiet moment.

11:28SPEAKER_01:Iconic. They were the biggest celebrity there.

11:31SPEAKER_00:Probably, yeah. Aside from me.

11:35SPEAKER_01:You already he first.

11:37SPEAKER_00:Okay, so Ramon, have you seen that meme that's like, you're not ugly, you're just poor?

11:43unknown:Yeah.

11:44SPEAKER_00:Um, a lot of content online, I think, is now devoted to plastic surgery, celebrity plastic surgery, um, you know, judging people's plastic surgery, saying that people had good or bad work done.

12:00SPEAKER_01:I mean, this entire accounts will they were they will break down a celebrity's face, and here's they'll be like, here's all the work I that this celebrities allegedly had done.

12:09SPEAKER_00:To beep beep. So, well, one thing on that. Um, I would just like to say I'm not going to speculate on what people have had done had they not said it, because I think it's really corny when doctors get up on the internet and talk about what they think these celebrities have had done because you don't know. You don't know. And the reason I say that is because uh, you know, we always say in medicine there's several ways to skin a cat. Like you could achieve a result different types of ways.

12:45SPEAKER_00:And especially, I saw one plastic surgeon talking about um a certain celebrity like looking like they had an eye lift when you could clearly see the face tapes, which, if y'all don't know, a lot of these celebrities get a lifted look by putting these tapes on their face that connect by like an elastic behind their head that's hidden in their hair and it just pulls them for events. So a lot of these people don't know what they're talking about.

13:12SPEAKER_01:T.

13:13SPEAKER_00:Um, maybe like the first celebrity that comes to mind for me is Chris Jenner, though.

13:18SPEAKER_01:Facelift.

13:19SPEAKER_00:Because she talked about getting a facelift and actually gave props to her doctor because now people are like, oh, who's the doctor that treated Chris Jenner or Lindsay Lohan? Yeah.

13:31SPEAKER_01:And I mean, the work, it's great. What's funny is I mean, Chris Jenner coming from the Kardashian clan, like that family is the poster children of different procedures. My question is, why are so many celebrities really reluctant to be open and transparent about what work they've had done? Remember, Kylie, for the longest time, was like, no, it's all natural, it's all natural, and then recently was like, here's the details from my boob job.

13:53SPEAKER_00:I think back then it was because she was young and she was trying to sell these lip kits. So potentially it was that. Um, I think the interesting thing about Chris Jenner is now you get trolls online saying that her facelift already fell or something, or she only looked good because of swelling. But yeah, a lot of celebrities have been more forthcoming about it. Like Denise Richards was talking about getting her facelift. I just saw a clip of her on a podcast talking about it in depth.

14:21SPEAKER_00:And I mean, she looks really good. Like she looks like herself too, um, which I think is part of the issue that some people are having commenting on uh celebrities getting plastic surgery. It's just like a lot of them look very different. The one that comes to mind is Mandy Moore. Wait, what?

14:40SPEAKER_01:This does it look weird?

14:41SPEAKER_00:I mean, people were speculating that she got an upper bleff and she's had hooded eyes her entire life.

14:47SPEAKER_01:I'm Googling it right now.

14:48SPEAKER_00:And I must say, she does look like a different person.

14:52SPEAKER_01:That is actually crazy. Wow, it doesn't even look like her.

14:56SPEAKER_00:So some people, you know, in the quest to look younger, I think are erasing some of the features that made them unique.

15:07SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Well, it's kind of like the everyone has something done now, and what's that whole meme of these very surged actors doing period pieces now? So you have someone doing like 18th century English period piece, and they're like lifted, plumped, pickled.

15:26SPEAKER_00:That's a face that's seen an iPhone. Literally, yeah, yeah. I mean, that's definitely a thing. I think some of the aesthetic choices that are made now obviously wouldn't have existed back then. Number one being dental work. I'm I'm sure people did not have nice teeth, especially the the these British period pieces. Those teeth wouldn't be looking like that.

15:51SPEAKER_02:No.

15:52SPEAKER_00:So but uh yeah, I mean, I think it's just come more and more into fashion to talk about these things or commentate on them. What do you think about uh people who say it's you know better that celebrities are sharing because people could be, you know, realistic now about what what they're seeing versus you know people's privacy.

16:17SPEAKER_01:I mean, that level of transparency to me is valuable and important. I think back to we talk about this a lot on the podcast, but like in the early 2000s, like the crazy diet culture and how a lot of celebrities are getting scary skinny. And they were like, no, it's just like diet and exercise. And we're like, it's not just that. So people being a lot more transparent with like what they do or how they achieve the results that they get. Not that it's gonna make it more attainable, but it humanizes them to some degree.

16:42SPEAKER_00:It humanizes them. And I also think that potentially a lot of just like members of the public, regular ass people may feel bad about themselves or specifically about the way that they're aging, looking at celebrities. It's like, why does um, you know, the practical magic two just came out and they're like, oh, like Nicole Kidman and Sandra Bullock look so similar to how they did in the 90s, which I I don't think that's true. They don't look the same, but they look so young.

17:12SPEAKER_00:Like, how did they do? And it's like obviously money.

17:17SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I mean, there's always pressure, especially on women, and especially in Hollywood, to maintain a level or an air of youth. Um, because you know, essentially age is tied to relevancy, and that's your career. The minute you become a certain age, it's kind of like you're washed up. But what's funny is how does that then reflect on like the male celebrities in Hollywood? And like I feel like it's less what's the word? You don't see so many guys that have had very obvious work.

17:47SPEAKER_00:Yeah, because they don't have to. Correct. I think when it comes to women in Hollywood in general, or just women generally, it's like you're kind of damned if you do, damned if you don't, because if you try to just age how you naturally would, people are gonna criticize your looks. And if you go too far in the other direction and have too much done, then people are gonna criticize you for that too. Um, I think one exception to that is probably I'm thinking of Dolly Parton, rest in peace.

18:17SPEAKER_00:But she was always very forthcoming about the fact that she had a lot of plastic surgery, and I don't think anybody really like judged her for that.

18:27SPEAKER_01:I think she played into it enough where people respected her a lot more. Um, Cher's another example.

18:34SPEAKER_00:Oh, yeah. I mean, I don't know how forthcoming she's been about the work that she's had done, but I don't think she shies away from it. She's not the type of person that I've ever heard say, like, oh no, I've never done anything. I know Nicole Kidman, at least years ago, all she had said was, Oh, I had Botox once, um, and I didn't like it.

18:57unknown:Okay.

18:58SPEAKER_00:Okay, sure. But I mean, maybe she didn't like Botox, but it's definitely not all that has happened. So I don't know. I think people need to have realistic expectations. However, I can't tell you how many patients I see in my practice, and obviously, this is you know, selection bias, probably, that are like, uh, eventually I'm gonna get a facelift. Like, facelifts are just so much more like in the public consciousness now, and people just kind of assume they're gonna get one.

19:31SPEAKER_01:Yeah. I mean, growing up surrounded by media, I feel like back in the early 2000s, late early 2000s, late 90s, the facelifts that were seen or done, they weren't amazing. So we've progressed a lot in that regard. So facelifts now, they look amazing, they look incredible. Um and so I think the fact that they are more attainable and they look really good now, it's more an more of an incentive for people to like plan on getting one in the future.

19:59SPEAKER_00:Yeah. I know for me, I'm like I would be open to it. I don't know if I'm gonna need one. Okay. Well, I'm I'm doing a lot preventatively, and I mean it's a big procedure. I think that's another thing that maybe people don't realize. It's a big deal, and for some of this stuff, for any plastic surgery, people are like traveling in order to do it, and that's something that I'm like, it's risky.

20:27SPEAKER_01:I think of the girls coming back from like DR with BBLs, and they can't sit on the seats.

20:32SPEAKER_00:Yeah, yeah, that or I mean it's like anything, like uh, you know, guys going to Istanbul to get their hair transplants, and everybody coming on back on the plane has had their yeah, has their like plugs in. I mean, my issue with people uh traveling for these big procedures is that what if a complication happens? What you're you're staying in this country for a week max. What happens when you have an issue? Are you gonna fly back?

21:04SPEAKER_01:They see it as like, oh, it's a very cosmetic, very simple thing. And I'm like, no, it's still surgery, and a lot of things can happen.

21:11SPEAKER_00:It's not just, yeah. So these deep plane facelifts that they're doing now, they're not just pulling back your skin. They're going in and dissecting into your smash layer, which is deep, and they're pulling that because if all you do is pull skin back, eventually that's just gonna fall. You need to pull the actual structures that are underneath the skin that give your face that structure. So these are not small surgeries, and sometimes the incisions can be really big.

21:43SPEAKER_00:Um, and I'm always saying you you don't realize when you're looking at good work most of the time, you only realize the bad work when people are overpulled or their scars look bad, or it's something like that. Like, even with hair transplants, I'm like some of these hairlines they're putting on these guys. They're too hard. And they're they're not truthful to uh the man's age necessarily. Um so it's like you could you could spot that from a mile away.

22:15SPEAKER_01:My favorite is when the work is so drastic where it's like we literally saw you three months ago, you did not look like this. Um and so it's like obviously something got done, and then a year later it's here's my skincare line. Here's my hair care line.

22:31SPEAKER_00:Speaking of Lindsay Lohan, yeah, who one of her doctors was revealed who it was, but yeah, skincare. She's getting into skincare.

22:39SPEAKER_01:I mean, Martha Stewart got snatched back, and then she launched uh what's it called?

22:45SPEAKER_00:Skincare, yeah, Elm. Yeah. Which I don't know. I I feel like their story isn't so much that uh she's been using it forever. It's more like she helped found it and fund it, and they're doing research and making interesting concepts. Interesting concepts. So at least I'm like, she gets a pass for me. Also, she's uh I think another one who's been totally transparent about the work that she's had done, so it's not like she's pretending.

23:13SPEAKER_01:Yeah.

23:14SPEAKER_00:So she's kind of a real one.

23:17SPEAKER_01:And a baddie.

23:19SPEAKER_00:Oh, as we're filming this yesterday, she posted a uh selfie with the caption thinking about leaking my nudes or something. You know what? Leak it. Go off. Go off, Martha. Another thing that I've noticed, though, is speaking about Instagram face, uh, everybody trying to get the same facial features. That's another thing.

23:43SPEAKER_01:That's my beef with the work. And here's the deal face is natural. I have certain features that people, I guess, do not find attractive. They feel like uh it's easy to make fun of. For example, I get the Nigel Thorm Thornberry gifts underneath my video sometimes. Really? I got a big nose. I don't give a shit. Like, it does not phase me necessarily, but I always think like, why would I get surgery to have the same cookie cutter face everyone else has?

24:08SPEAKER_01:To me, like, there's just a level of be different. Why do you feel the need to like have the same face as everyone else?

24:15SPEAKER_00:It's true. Like, okay, so for talking about noses, you think your nose is big. I got you. Like nose off, nose off, right here. Nose convention. Um, there have been several times in my life where I've thought about like, ooh, should I get a nose job? Should I just refine it a little bit? And part of me has been like, my nose is like kind of a signifier of my heritage. So that's one thing. And two, like, I don't want to end up looking like everybody else.

24:44SPEAKER_00:Part of what stopped me from it is looking at everybody's befores and afters and seeing everybody get the same damn nose. And a lot of the time it does not look good.

24:56SPEAKER_01:Like it's not proportioned and sized for the face and the surrounding structures. Like it should still be flattering.

25:03SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And I think a lot of the time, one issue that I've seen is that they're getting rid of the dorsal hump on people's noses, but not bringing in their tips. So it just looks like a very long, straight line. Or um, I can tell when people have gotten their nose done in Turkey.

25:21unknown:Yeah.

25:22SPEAKER_00:There is a look. Especially on a guy. Oh my God. Why would you want that? Like it just doesn't fit their face. That's the thing. So I've I've come to terms with my large nose, and I'm fine with it. I mean, I'm happy about it.

25:40SPEAKER_01:I like looking different. I was literally at uh Sephora the other day, and somebody walked by me, and I was like, very casual, baseball cap on, and she's like, You have beautiful facial features. I was like, Thank you. You do, I do, and I'm humble. But I'm just like, yeah. Not to say that if I ever had the chance, I would definitely go to the doctor and be like, so I want this face, and it'll probably be like Madison Beer. Stunning.

26:08SPEAKER_00:You'd be Madison Beer. I want her face.

26:11SPEAKER_01:Her or I mean Bella Hadid, stunning.

26:15SPEAKER_00:Well, I mean, she showed somebody a photo and got that face, so you could do it too.

26:20SPEAKER_01:I love Carla Bruni. Exactly.

26:27SPEAKER_00:Oh man.

26:28SPEAKER_01:If you could have another face, whose face would it be?

26:30SPEAKER_00:Ooh, whose face would I have? I would say young Marlon Brando.

26:36SPEAKER_01:Okay. My two would either be Maluma.

26:42SPEAKER_00:Oh.

26:43SPEAKER_01:Or you would know him, Sean O'Pry. The model. Oh, really? Okay. Love his eyes and his lips.

26:52SPEAKER_00:My second, and I mean, oh, I'm just going with like the method actors from the 50s and 60s, James Dean.

26:59SPEAKER_01:James Dean.

27:01SPEAKER_00:That was quite a face.

27:05SPEAKER_01:Jack Nicholson.

27:08SPEAKER_00:If you want to look. The stuff that man can do with his eyebrows.

27:14SPEAKER_01:I'm in Jim Carrey.

27:16SPEAKER_00:Oh, yeah. Oh. Terrifying. Speaking of people speculating about people getting work done, so men. Um recently, Jim Carrey, people were you uh privy to this whole thing where he went to accept an award in France?

27:34SPEAKER_01:I vaguely remember this, yeah.

27:36SPEAKER_00:And people were saying it was somebody like being an imposter. Yeah, we talked about this in the pod too. Like people were speculating that it was Alexis Stone. Yes. Who, for those of you who don't know, Alexis Stone is a drag artist who's known for doing like celebrity impressions. Yeah. She's really good at doing um prosthetic makeup to look like other people. So she's done um like Jennifer Coolidge, Jocelyn Wildenstein, Mrs. Doubtfire. Um, but people had to be like, oh, well, actually, we Alexis Stone was publicly somewhere else at the same time.

28:13SPEAKER_00:So um, yeah, but people were just speculating about his face. I think more and more men, at least in Hollywood, are turning towards going for the surgery.

28:26SPEAKER_01:I mean, especially in the age of social media, the pressure is increasing on men to look a certain way. We talked about looks maximum before, but it's really interesting the approach to it. I always say, like, my dad will always come up to me and be like, How do I fix this? And I'm like, sir, you are in your 50s. The stand the sun damage is crazy. Also, 30 years in the military has done horrible things to that man's body. But I'm like, surgery. Surgery is the only solution.

28:53SPEAKER_01:And he's like, Oh, damn. But I'm like, girl, get the get the bluff if you want it. If it'll make you feel good, also you're in your 50s, you're in your 60s. That's like, why not reinvent yourself? Like be who you are for your pride.

29:09SPEAKER_00:For your pride. I also think there are some people who only think that there are these drastic measures and that's all that they can do. And I mean, I'll say this until I'm blue in the face. Like, people don't work on their skin quality enough. And that, as far as a youthful appearance, getting rid of sun damage does so much uh for for your look. And I think people don't realize uh that that's that's actually about accepting yourself because you're getting rid of what the sun did to you so that you could look like your natural self.

29:44SPEAKER_01:I think people neglect to understand what photo aging actually looks like and the impact of sun damage. And aging, and especially for skin of color, isn't solely based on fine lines and wrinkles. Pigmentation and discoloration, even skin tones, are really big indicators of that visually. So to Angelo's point, uh, working on those more topically will do so much just to like, you know, rejuvenate your look.

30:10SPEAKER_00:Yeah, get a laser done.

30:12SPEAKER_01:Wear your sunscreen.

30:13SPEAKER_00:Wear your sunscreen, too, by the way. Uh, but yeah, I think men especially are getting more and more hair transplants than they used to. Even celebrity men like Andrew Garfield. You think he got a hair transplant?

30:32SPEAKER_01:Uh there's before and afters.

30:33SPEAKER_00:Oh, really? It looks great. Um, who else people are saying like Harry Styles, Jamie Foxx.

30:39SPEAKER_01:No, Harry Styles. Everyone was alleging it was a wig for a long time. A piece. Well, I I think for him it was like this thing of okay, he was between album cycles, and then suddenly he had a crew cut, and it's like going back to like men and the pressure put on them, one thing I think is really interesting about social media is to some degree the empowerment or at least the attempt to normalize, like it's okay to like want to get a hair transplant or even uh do we call them toupee still?

31:10SPEAKER_00:Hair pieces.

31:11SPEAKER_01:Hair pieces, yeah. Units. And I mean, those units look so good. And the the impact of a really good unit, it does a lot to bring back a really youthful appearance. But I've seen a lot of content on my for you page about guys really trying to normalize that. Or here's here's my hair transplant journey.

31:27SPEAKER_00:I think the difference that it could make for a man is is huge. Some of these guys that I've seen doing their wig installs and all that, it's like you look at them before and you're like, wow, okay, you're however old. And then once that thing is on, you're like, wow, you look like five to ten years younger. Yeah.

31:48SPEAKER_01:I feel like people always comment on how Angelo and I talk about surgery and what people do. Fundamentally, at the end of the day, we support you doing what is going to make you happy and confident in yourself in whatever capacity that means. We don't judge, we just comment.

32:05SPEAKER_00:Some men can rock a bald head too, like really well.

32:09SPEAKER_01:Vin Diesel.

32:11SPEAKER_00:True. Yeah, that's been part of his brand for so long. But yeah, it's like that could also be like a really sexy, masculine look. It doesn't necessarily need to be that you have a youthful hairline back or something like that. But shave your head if you want. Do the thing, grow it out, grow it out. That's another thing. Yeah, I think guys don't vary their hair enough, especially the straight ones. But I don't know. I know for me, it's funny because I'll get served uh in the TikTok app like on this day or whatever, like my old posts, and I've been posting for so long, and one day I was seeing like going through the years, I'm like, these are different people.

32:56SPEAKER_00:Like, I looked totally different, like every single year.

33:00SPEAKER_01:No, that's not I remember Twink Angelo.

33:04SPEAKER_00:Has my twink death happened? People still call me a twink online, and I'm like, I don't think you know what a twink is.

33:11SPEAKER_01:Yeah, we get that comment a lot on our videos.

33:15SPEAKER_00:Apparently, we are uh twinks-in-law. Because somebody asked if we were related.

33:24SPEAKER_01:You know, maybe cousins down the line.

33:26SPEAKER_00:Maybe. Actually.

33:28SPEAKER_01:The way things work in Puerto Rico, probably.

33:30SPEAKER_00:Yeah. It's an island, so fun fact.

33:34SPEAKER_01:In in Latin culture, a lot of times you'll take both parents' last names, so your dad's and your mom's. Remember, I was at an aunt's wedding, and I don't know how we got to my grandfather. Um, he had the same last names, so doubled. And I was like, why? My dad's like, his parents were cousins. I was like, got it.

33:55SPEAKER_00:Oh no.

33:56SPEAKER_01:Different time, different era.

34:00SPEAKER_00:Yeah, that used to happen. One thing that I noticed too is like sometimes people have unrealistic expectations, or there is this kind of like perception drift in what is normal. I especially saw this during like the filler era. So thinking about like five years ago, I would get people who would come to me asking for stuff that I would just say no.

34:27SPEAKER_01:Like what? What was the most popular or common thing?

34:30SPEAKER_00:Uh I think people wanting to get like their cheeks and jawline filled more and more, like that at a certain point, people start looking like an alien. Cheek filler was very popular, and I think it could do a lot for some people, but if you do too much of it, like not everybody has these cheekbones that are jutting out so far. And if you're trying to do it as an anti-aging measure, because our zygoma here, this bone resorbs over time, as do some of the fat pads.

35:02SPEAKER_00:What over times? What is what do you say it resorbs?

35:06SPEAKER_01:What does that mean?

35:07SPEAKER_00:It like the bone gets smaller, it gets absorbed. Yeah. So if you fill here too much, then your temples start to look hollow, and hollow temples are also a sign of an aging face that people, you know, will clock uh totally unconsciously. So it's about finding balance and not having that perception drift. I saw somebody bring up uh they went to an aesthetics conference recently, and they were like, I would never let some of these people, you know, work on me because they look crazy.

35:44SPEAKER_00:And I think when you're around the stuff all the time, you start partaking a little bit too much.

35:49SPEAKER_01:I mean, the way there's blush blindness or is very much like filler blindness. There's that one, the one video of Gaga I sent you where she was just she was filled, honey.

35:57SPEAKER_00:Oh, yeah. I think every star kind of had that era, like, I don't know, looking like Vladimir Putin. That man has had filler, a lot of it.

36:08SPEAKER_02:Okay.

36:11SPEAKER_00:Allegedly. Um, so I do think that there are some people in the industry that have that perception drift where you know they're looking at their face too much, or they're starting to think that you need this, this, and that. And if I may be frank, a lot of the times it's like the less skilled providers because they're trying to change something. And I always say, when all you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. They don't know what they don't know, they don't know about other tools that are like not in their toolbox that they could go for.

36:45SPEAKER_00:And they're doing this to patients too. I've had so many people come to me saying, Oh, they got Botox literally in almost every muscle that you could get it, like over a hundred units at a time. And I was like, why? Some of those things certain people don't need. Um, I think especially targeting people's lower face sometimes, the masseters for slimming, this uh depressor anguliorus muscle, the DAO for a downturned mouth. It's like if the mouth is not sloping down, you don't need to inject here.

37:21SPEAKER_00:People's mentalis, which is the muscle that kind of uh dimples up your chin and makes it kind of look like orange skin when you flex it. It's like if you're not having chin dimpling and you don't have a tight chin, you don't need it. Chin tight, chin tight. So basically, you like just see these injectors injecting for the sake of bringing it somewhere without intent, without intent, like not looking at the face, really, not doing a thorough consultation.

37:51SPEAKER_00:And it's just like they're selling these people everything. And I gotta say, a lot of these interventions, it's like if you're not the right candidate, they're not gonna do anything for you. So that's why I say consultation is always the most important. I try to save people money, if anything, if they come to me. I want to get them to the result that they want in the easiest way possible for them. Um, sometimes you need to take into account, okay, some people want speed, some people want less downtime, of course, but I'm not gonna pitch people, say, I don't know, like IPL if they don't have uh sun damage or redness or something that we could actually work on with that.

38:34SPEAKER_00:Like I will not tell them to get it just because, oh, it's a good measure to have. Yeah.

38:39SPEAKER_01:Again, meet them where they're at. What do they actually need? Assess what actually is gonna get them the benefit or the end result that they're going for. And like I said earlier, that's a good provider. That's a good doctor. Not him, though.

38:53SPEAKER_00:You just wait until get my hands on your face.

38:57SPEAKER_01:Hopefully, soon I need it. What would you give me?

39:02SPEAKER_00:No, see, I don't do this outside of a setting. It needs to be a real consultation.

39:09unknown:Ugh.

39:09SPEAKER_01:I'll live stream that when it happens.

39:11SPEAKER_00:Well, also, a lot of the time, yeah, patients come to me and they're like, what would you do? And I always go back to them. It's like, what are you noticing? What bothers you? Like, those are the things that I want to address. I don't like just have people sit in front of me and be like, you should get this, this, and that. It's like none of it is necessary if it's cosmetic. So I'm just like, tell me what you're thinking. Tell me what concerns you.

39:37SPEAKER_00:Tell me what you would like to change.

39:38SPEAKER_01:Because the thing is, like, they're asking you that, expecting you to be like, well, you're busted down. You should do XYZ. And it's like, no, you're beautiful, but what would you like to, what would you like to target?

39:48SPEAKER_00:I will never forget one of the first times I got my lips filled. It was during a training session where me and my co-residents were learning from a plastic surgeon. And I said, Oh, my lips are a little bit asymmetrical. So I wanted that addressed. And then he just goes off with, Well, your eyes are different sizes. This whole side of your face is underdeveloped. You have one cheek projecting more than the other. And I was like, I know he was making a point about chasing symmetry.

40:21SPEAKER_00:I know now that that's something that you kind of can't do that much with the procedures that we do. It's like you could try to bring it close, but I never promise people that I could bring them into perfect symmetry. But he didn't have to go off like that. I didn't say anything about the rest of my face. Drag her. He, yeah, he put me in my place. He dragged me.

40:44SPEAKER_01:I would have fought him.

40:46SPEAKER_00:Could you imagine? I could.

40:47SPEAKER_01:I would.

40:48SPEAKER_00:You would have fought. I came close a few times. Not with him, but we kept it cute. We kept it professional. So, um, I want to know from our viewers and listeners, if you're on a platform where you could leave a comment, do you think it's a good thing that celebs are being more transparent with the work that they've had done? Do you think that we should drop the stigma? Or do you think that we should drop the stigma of around to aging in general?

41:17SPEAKER_00:I mean, I do. Yeah. But like what is the way to go? How do we go forward? Obviously, there's no perfect way.

41:22SPEAKER_01:You can't please everyone.

41:24SPEAKER_00:Exactly. But that being said, we hope you're pleased with this episode. Give us a like, hype us up. Five stars. Subscribe if you haven't already, just so that we come up in wherever your podcast feed is every week because we're not stopping.

41:44SPEAKER_01:Round after round after round, episode after episode after episode.

41:49SPEAKER_00:Until we're both dead. We're tired. Or tired.

41:54SPEAKER_01:But thanks for listening, guys.

41:56SPEAKER_00:Bye.