​Mackenzie Astin Meets World

0:05Speaker 1:Thank you.

0:22Speaker 2:Oh, God. Here we go.

0:24Speaker 1:It's Ryder's favorite way to start.

0:26Speaker 2:T-shirt cannon!

0:30Speaker 4:Oh, it's Ryder's favorite. He gets to get a thing of Bud Light and we are ready to go.

0:35Speaker 1:Oh, my God.

0:35Speaker 2:Hell yes.

0:37Speaker 5:Ladies and gentlemen, we are happy to present to you Lee Norris. And Marla Sokolov.

0:46Speaker 3:Oh, my God. It's a season one reunion.

0:48Speaker 1:It sure is.

0:49Speaker 6:Season one of Boy Meets World, episode five.

0:53Speaker 1:I mean, some of you might say it's a class reunion.

0:57Speaker 4:I don't know.

0:57Speaker 1:You see what I did there?

0:59Speaker 5:So for our dear listeners who don't already know, you know Lee as Stuart Mankus or Mouth on One Tree Hill. Marla played Gia on Full House, Lucy Hatcher on The Practice, and Fish Girl.

1:14Speaker 2:On Boy Meets World. Hell yes.

1:16Speaker 1:We very kindly. No, she was the one who pulled the fish out.

1:19Speaker 7:Oh, I'm like, I don't remember that.

1:21Speaker 8:I don't remember that either.

1:22Speaker 5:Remember you pulled the fish skeleton in that episode out of the jar?

1:27Speaker 7:I'm going to re-watch.

1:29Speaker 8:Exactly.

1:29Speaker 5:Maybe you were the girl standing next to the girl who pulled out the fish?

1:33Speaker 7:Did you have a character name? I have no idea. Yeah, I think it was Paige.

1:38Speaker 2:Well, it's better than Fish Girl.

1:40Speaker 9:Not as good as Fish Girl.

1:41Speaker 7:Literally, please address me by my character.

1:45Speaker 2:Fish Girl, it's like the worst Marvel character ever. It's like they're just calling her Fish Girl.

1:49Speaker 3:They're not even trying anymore.

1:50Speaker 9:What does that mean?

1:51Speaker 1:She's got gills? What's happening here?

1:55Speaker 5:So, yeah, we have a little Mr. Feeny class reunion as you two are the newest hosts in the Podmeets world universe.

2:02Speaker 1:Welcome. Thank you.

2:05Speaker 4:Yay.

2:06Speaker 8:What a dream. We have hoodwinked you into this somehow. We're just going to run with it. I don't know.

2:10Speaker 3:Well, I think one of the.

2:12Speaker 4:Reasons we got hoodwinked into this is because Ryder and I were doing In the City, and you very nicely called and essentially said, you guys have no idea what you're doing or talking about with the Marvel world.

2:22Speaker 2:No, we're not. I did not.

2:25Speaker 8:In fact, I said, you don't need any help at all.

2:30Speaker 7:But.

2:31Speaker 8:I am kind of a weirdo who loves this stuff. So if you ever want to know more about, you know, the whole universe.

2:37Speaker 2:And we did.

2:38Speaker 8:I'm always looking for reasons to hang out with you guys.

2:40Speaker 5:I'm so glad you did because none of us knew what an expert you were. So you sent in a field report to Pod Meets Twirled. And finding out you know everything about the Bravo universe. Then led us to Marla, who is also a Bravo super fan. And now we have an incredible new show. And you two are going to Bravo Fest in October.

3:04Speaker 7:I still don't even understand what you're saying. That is so exciting.

3:08Speaker 4:What?

3:10Speaker 2:What is Bravo Fest?

3:11Speaker 5:Ryder and Will don't understand it either, but for a different reason.

3:14Speaker 2:It's called Ryder's Hell Fest. Ironically, the same weekend in the same place.

3:21Speaker 1:Tell Ryder and Will about Bravo Fest.

3:24Speaker 10:So there's Bravo Fest and Bravo Con. And the way that I understand it, Bravo Con is every other year. And Bravo Fest, it's like little sister who's kind of holding us all over until we get back to Bravo Con.

3:35Speaker 7:Bravo stars come. They do panels.

3:37Speaker 10:They do interviews. They, you know, are among the people, which Lee and I will be with the people.

3:44Speaker 7:We are so excited.

3:45Speaker 8:Well, technically, Marla, I think we are credentialed press. I think iHeart has, I think we are going in as true reporters, like really tackling the tough issues of the day.

3:57Speaker 7:Yeah, the hard-hitting news.

3:58Speaker 3:And you know what?

4:00Speaker 7:Someone has to do it. We're not afraid to ask the hard-hitting questions either. So they better get ready for us.

4:06Speaker 3:No.

4:06Speaker 2:Oh, that's great.

4:07Speaker 4:Do you have to throw a drink in someone's face just to get into the fest?

4:11Speaker 3:Absolutely.

4:11Speaker 7:Yeah, you gotta flip a table.

4:13Speaker 2:That's what I thought. That's what I thought.

4:15Speaker 4:Okay.

4:16Speaker 3:Yeah.

4:16Speaker 7:Excellent.

4:17Speaker 8:We're already devising like big fights that we can have in public to try to, you know, maybe end up on one.

4:22Speaker 4:Of the shows.

4:27Speaker 5:I heard that you have already met a real housewife of Salt Lake City.

4:31Speaker 3:Yeah.

4:32Speaker 1:And that is the first show you guys are covering, right?

4:35Speaker 3:It is.

4:35Speaker 1:The Real Housewives of Salt Lake City. How did you meet her?

4:37Speaker 7:Would you like to tell Gloria's story?

4:39Speaker 8:I knew you were going to do this to me, Marla. So I flew into L.A. because I don't live in L.A. I live on the East Coast. And so I flew into L.A. to– reconnect with Marla and, you know, do all the press and record a couple of episodes. So we were in the I Heart building in L.A. and they said, there's a housewife in the building. And I think immediately the hairs on both of our, you know, arms like stood up. And we said, and they said, and she's from Salt Lake. And so we've just binged Salt Lake, you know, in preparation for this show. So we're like, it's got to be Heather. Who is it?

5:10Speaker 8:And they said, it's Brittany, who... you know, lovely person in real life, but probably.

5:18Speaker 7:How do you feel about her?

5:20Speaker 8:I knew you were going to do this. Probably my least favorite housewife on the show.

5:23Speaker 3:Okay.

5:24Speaker 2:Personality wise, or is she the villain?

5:26Speaker 8:I'm sure it was an unkind edit, Will. Let's say that.

5:29Speaker 2:Let's say an unkind edit.

5:31Speaker 8:So, you know, I was a little bit nervous about this because she was so nice. And then we went and sat down and recorded. And then of course I got to tell Marla all about how she's, my least favorite of the housewives. I'm so sorry, Brittany. I know.

5:46Speaker 2:Oh, already your podcast is super interesting.

5:49Speaker 6:I mean, I love it.

5:50Speaker 8:I mean, what have we gotten into? I have no idea.

5:53Speaker 3:Yeah.

5:54Speaker 10:I definitely did that thing where I drove home and I was like, people are going to hear that.

5:58Speaker 7:What I just said, I might need to like reel.

6:01Speaker 2:In a little bit. Like, no, no, no.

6:05Speaker 3:I really need more.

6:06Speaker 7:Bravo friends, clearly. So I'm really working on my Bravo friend list. So I need to be very kind.

6:13Speaker 10:No, it became pretty clear right away that Lee's the one who was worried about people not liking him.

6:19Speaker 7:And I was like, I'm sorry. Don't act like that on TV.

6:22Speaker 8:It's the child actor in me, guys.

6:23Speaker 2:That's me too. I'm the same way.

6:25Speaker 3:Totally. You have to let it go.

6:27Speaker 6:That's like my biggest advice to you guys, because that's what we, we had this debate when we first started our podcast is like, how honest do we want to be about our experiences on Boy Meets World? And like, it's turned out the more honest you are, the more you just are yourself, the more.

6:41Speaker 3:The listeners understand.

6:42Speaker 2:They appreciate it. And you actually, those are the listeners you want. You know what I mean?

6:47Speaker 3:That's the relationship you want.

6:49Speaker 6:Because if you think about, if you were listening to a podcast where people were just super fake and all kind, it would be really boring. So you have to be yourself.

6:57Speaker 4:That being said, Brittany's a good friend of mine, so I can't listen to podcasts anymore.

7:01Speaker 3:So what the hell? But either way.

7:03Speaker 8:Thanks, guys.

7:04Speaker 3:I'm out of here.

7:05Speaker 7:Goodbye.

7:05Speaker 3:God, go to hell.

7:09Speaker 5:Well, the show debuts this Saturday on the Pod Meets World feed. And who saw this coming? This is the gift that keeps on giving. We're so honored and lucky to have you both. So thank you for agreeing to do this.

7:23Speaker 1:And maybe, who knows, maybe one day Mr. Turner and Eli can do a sports podcast or something.

7:28Speaker 3:Oh my God, that'd be great.

7:30Speaker 9:Wouldn't that be fun?

7:31Speaker 1:Who knows?

7:32Speaker 5:But Marla, Lee, we're so excited for Class Reunion, again, debuting this Saturday.

7:37Speaker 8:Come hang out with us. Come see us. We're going to drag you into this world.

7:41Speaker 2:Whether you want to be there or not. You better.

7:43Speaker 4:When you get into the next season of In the City, please don't tell.

7:47Speaker 3:Me about it.

7:51Speaker 8:Thank you, guys. This is a dream.

7:52Speaker 3:Thank you, guys. We're so excited. I'll see you soon.

7:54Speaker 11:Yes.

7:55Speaker 3:Thank you.

7:56Speaker 7:We'll see you soon.

7:56Speaker 3:Bye. Bye. Bye.

8:10Speaker 6:I had a dream about Bill Daniels.

8:13Speaker 7:You did?

8:14Speaker 6:I had like a very vivid, really sweet dream where it was us now. I was an adult and he was older. and we were at craft service and somebody was saying, Ryder, you and Bill are gonna do a scene and you gotta, you know, and I had to be the one sort of in charge because Bill's older and they were like, are you gonna be okay? And I was like, Bill, you and I get to work together. And he gave me the biggest smile, came over and hooked his arm with me. And we like walked away from craft service. And I was so excited in my dream to work with him and to be like the one in charge, you know, to be the authority.

8:52Speaker 8:I was the.

8:52Speaker 6:Authority with Bill and it was, and it was just this warm feeling. And that's all I remember that I think the dream ended at that point. Like I didn't, I don't do the scene or, but it was like, it was kind of like an, an, an inverse of the actor's anxiety dream. You know, it was like, I was ready to do the scene because it was me and Bill.

9:07Speaker 3:It was so sweet. It was such like a- And.

9:09Speaker 5:You were empowered as a grown man, as a peer.

9:14Speaker 1:Look at that.

9:15Speaker 3:Yeah.

9:16Speaker 4:I had one where my fingers were hot dogs and I was really excited.

9:19Speaker 9:Such similar dreams.

9:21Speaker 8:Yeah.

9:22Speaker 9:You know what?

9:22Speaker 1:It's because you're both 11 brothers.

9:26Speaker 2:It's what it is.

9:26Speaker 4:You're right.

9:27Speaker 1:It's the power of the 11.

9:30Speaker 9:Indy gave the best quote yesterday.

9:33Speaker 3:You know, you think your kid's smart.

9:39Speaker 6:He pulls his hat off because we're doing a hike and he pulls his hat off and he's like, are we here?

9:44Speaker 3:Mom, smell my hat. It smells like a hot dog. Alex is like, why would I do that? Why would I want to smell your, no, no, dad.

9:54Speaker 1:You'll smell it.

9:55Speaker 2:Dad, smell my, it smells like hot dog.

9:58Speaker 3:Yes. I was like, I literally. wrote it down. I was like, that's going in something. That's a scene. Because that's like when you're interviewed for a school or something, you're like, my child.

10:06Speaker 1:Is a genius.

10:08Speaker 3:Mom, smell my head. It smells like hot dog.

10:13Speaker 1:Put it on my tombstone.

10:15Speaker 3:Oh, God.

10:18Speaker 9:Welcome to Pod Meets World.

10:19Speaker 1:I'm Danielle Fishel.

10:20Speaker 3:I'm Ryder Strong.

10:21Speaker 2:And I'm Will Friedle.

10:34Speaker 1:There's TV royalty, and then there's the Astons.

10:38Speaker 5:Our guest this week was born into one of those Hollywood families that not only will be remembered forever, they.

10:44Speaker 9:Will stay beloved.

10:45Speaker 1:A very difficult task in this business.

10:48Speaker 5:His father played Gomez Adams, and his mother, Patty Duke, was the youngest actress to win an Academy Award at the time for her portrayal of Helen Keller in The Miracle Worker, all before she starred on her own sitcom, The Patty Duke Show. And his brother is freaking Samwise. So there was quite a large shadow looming over his decision to enter the family business, but he emerged and has continued to create his own impressive legacy over the past 40 years. He was best known as a teenage late addition to the hit Facts of Life, but has since collected almost 200 credits with stops on shows like Lost, Mad Men, Scandal, Shameless House, and most recently, The Pit.

11:31Speaker 5:He's more than just a child actor success story. He is proof that with the right support system around you, you can not only make it out, but you can thrive. Please welcome to Podmeets World, one of the good guys, Mackenzie Astin.

11:44Speaker 3:Hello. Hello.

11:48Speaker 9:How are you?

11:49Speaker 1:Oh, can you see us? Can you hear us?

11:52Speaker 3:Can you guys hear me?

11:53Speaker 1:We can hear you and see you.

11:54Speaker 3:Shit, I can't hear you.

11:56Speaker 1:Uh-oh.

11:57Speaker 2:Can't hear you.

11:58Speaker 3:He can't hear you, so it doesn't matter. There it is. I'm in, I'm in. It's a whole new world. Hello, human beings. Hello.

12:06Speaker 1:How are you?

12:07Speaker 5:You know those beautiful videos where kids get hearing aids for the first time and they hear their mother's voice and you just see the world?

12:15Speaker 2:They start crying.

12:16Speaker 9:That's what happened just now for you.

12:17Speaker 3:Those were good videos. Were we rolling? We were rolling.

12:21Speaker 9:We're always rolling.

12:22Speaker 7:That's great.

12:23Speaker 3:Who's the oldest guy on screen?

12:25Speaker 1:Listen, we'll cut it, but this is just fun for us.

12:28Speaker 9:No, that's good.

12:28Speaker 1:Keep going.

12:30Speaker 2:I don't think you're that much older than me. I don't think you're that much older.

12:33Speaker 3:No, I think we're three years.

12:34Speaker 1:Oh, you've researched all of our ages.

12:37Speaker 4:Yeah.

12:37Speaker 3:Well, not all of them. Okay. But I did remember seeing 7-6 at one point. Is that correct? Yeah, that's me. How are you? Good, how are you? Nice to officially meet all of you people. I don't think, we've probably been in rooms together. I imagine. You two, but not you.

12:54Speaker 2:Yeah, I imagine so.

12:55Speaker 3:Where do I appear on your quadrant?

12:57Speaker 1:You're in my lower right.

12:59Speaker 3:Mine too. Me too. I'm lower right.

13:01Speaker 4:Mr.

13:02Speaker 3:Strong, sir, where am I for you? You're lower right, so yeah. Interesting.

13:06Speaker 9:Am I right above you?

13:08Speaker 1:I'm upper left.

13:08Speaker 3:You're upper left. I'm upper right.

13:10Speaker 7:Mr.

13:10Speaker 3:Friedel is lower left.

13:11Speaker 8:Mr.

13:12Speaker 3:Strong is lower right. That's great.

13:14Speaker 8:Oh, okay.

13:14Speaker 3:We got it all figured out.

13:16Speaker 1:Look at us.

13:17Speaker 5:I mean, there's nothing that makes for better radio than talking about Zoom positions.

13:24Speaker 3:Yeah, okay. Great. So we've covered he can't hear. And where are you on the screen? I know.

13:32Speaker 2:I think people are going to love that you're fascinated by the technology.

13:37Speaker 3:I mean I think that is an– it has an interesting affect on the conversation. Absolutely.

13:42Speaker 7:Sure.

13:43Speaker 8:No.

13:43Speaker 3:Your phone drops out. But that's not important right now.

13:49Speaker 1:But what is important?

13:51Speaker 5:Is that while researching and looking at your incredible body of work, it is very inspiring.

13:58Speaker 1:And you have been doing cool.

13:59Speaker 9:Stuff for 40 years.

14:01Speaker 7:Yeah.

14:02Speaker 9:Does it feel that long to you?

14:04Speaker 3:I had a root canal yesterday.

14:08Speaker 1:Okay.

14:10Speaker 3:So everything feels, you know. Painful.

14:12Speaker 7:Painful.

14:13Speaker 4:It does.

14:14Speaker 3:It does in some ways. And then also sometimes it feels like that was just yesterday. But there are definitely a few yesterdays before 1990 that are better in the past.

14:27Speaker 1:Okay.

14:29Speaker 3:As far as I'm concerned. Oh, yeah.

14:31Speaker 9:Well, we have to start.

14:32Speaker 5:I mean, we just kind of got to start in sort of a hacky place, but it's still worth asking.

14:37Speaker 4:Sure.

14:38Speaker 1:Having two legendary Hollywood parents.

14:41Speaker 5:Did you ever think you would be doing something other than acting?

14:45Speaker 3:No, not at all. Yes and no. For probably more years than was logical, I thought I might be a Major League Baseball player.

14:55Speaker 4:Wow.

14:56Speaker 10:Really?

14:56Speaker 9:What position did you play?

14:57Speaker 3:I was all over, but mostly on the infield. I'm not a very big guy. So I played short. I played second. So yeah, I had designs on that until I was old enough to know better. Okay. Like 30?

15:10Speaker 8:Yeah.

15:11Speaker 9:Sometimes that's a tough.

15:12Speaker 2:Professional sports is a tough dream to let go of.

15:14Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, yeah.

15:15Speaker 4:It is.

15:15Speaker 3:And I still haven't. But that's a good question because, no, there's nothing else that seemed logical or reasonable for– I think for my brother or I. to do you know it just was uh the natural progression of of things.

15:29Speaker 6:Yeah and when you when you were a kid would people say like were you performative or funny or actory in some ways and people be like we see it we know what's happening.

15:39Speaker 3:Yeah i think that happens i think that's i think that is you know it's uh it could be environmental it could be uh you know uh uh I almost said congenital. Genetic.

15:50Speaker 2:Or congenital works.

15:51Speaker 3:Congenital works. Congenital acting habit. I think if your parents are performers, it makes sense that there would be, you know, the dinner table was loud and you had to come in strong if you wanted to be heard. So, yeah. So I think, yeah, that definitely took place. People were like, oh, you should do that. But we both started so young that there wasn't much time for the you should thing. Because you're already doing it.

16:19Speaker 4:Well, I mean, I'm always curious because I've always said there's a very big difference between growing up in the business and being raised in the business. Like we're all child actors, but none of us grew up in entertainment families. So at what age did you realize that your family was different than other families?

16:36Speaker 3:Oh, man, I can't. I don't think there was a time that I didn't recognize it, in part because my parents were so popular with the general public that any time we went out, there was usually somebody that was like, oh, my God, I love your work on X, Y, or Z. So it was clear from the get-go that mom and dad were different than the majority of folks. Right. You know, which which was has always been a real blessing as far as I'm concerned, has always been wonderful because the response that people had to my parents was always, always, always and still is one of reverence and appreciation and joy.

17:17Speaker 3:You know, I've been in in taxi cabs in foreign countries or taxi cabs in this country with foreign people driving them or people from other countries driving them, you know, where the conversation will get to, you know, what are you doing or where are you going or, you know, and. Naturally, I always blame my parents for what I do for a living. And so, you know, I'll say, well, my dad played Gomez in the Adams family and people will light up. Absolutely light up. And then so, you know, so everywhere we went as youngsters, people received my folks really warmly. And, you know, it's very lucky, really.

17:51Speaker 5:This is the last time I'm going to apologize for asking a potentially hacky question, but having a dad who played the Gomez Adams, was Halloween crazy at all? Or did he look at that as bringing his work home?

18:03Speaker 1:What was that like?

18:04Speaker 3:So that's a great question. It's not hacky at all. So we had, and you could ask any one of my siblings, we had the house that we lived in in West Los Angeles, right by Westwood Village, was notorious for having the best Halloween setup. And I don't know if it was a byproduct or function of having been on the Adams family or just My mom and dad wanting to create an environment that was fun. And so we were right by the UCLA campus. And so tons of students, it was like Mecca on Halloween to go to this one house on this one street. You know, gravestones, flying ghosts coming down, the spooky music. Yes. What's that stuff called? It's very cold. You put it in water.

18:47Speaker 3:The dry ice.

18:47Speaker 8:The dry ice, yeah, sure.

18:48Speaker 3:You know, just all sorts of stuff that was– Oh, man.

18:52Speaker 2:Your family was doing effects back in the day.

18:53Speaker 4:Yeah. No, no.

18:54Speaker 3:It was great. It was great. We were putting on a show. My dad, one year, my dad dressed himself up as a scarecrow and sat– sat at the front door, you know, with like a straw or a newspaper or something sticking out of his sleeves and stuck still for, you know, a half an hour while people came up and down, up and down, up and down, and then finally moved and scared the heck out of people. It was like, you know, he was committed to the performance. So, yeah.

19:22Speaker 3:So Halloween, you can ask, you know who you can ask is Ted Stryker. Do you guys know the name Ted Stryker?

19:27Speaker 4:Yes.

19:28Speaker 3:So, that's a pseudonym, but Stryker and I were neighbors growing up. And so, if you come across him and you ask about- Radio guy. Yeah. You ask about Halloween, he will immediately say the Astons, man, the Astons.

19:42Speaker 8:That is so cool.

19:44Speaker 3:I love that.

19:44Speaker 2:That's cool.

19:45Speaker 5:I realized your dad also turned 96 this year.

19:48Speaker 1:He was working into his- 90s.

19:51Speaker 3:Yeah, he finally retired or was retired from teaching at Johns Hopkins University down the road here. uh, in 2023, I think. So he was 93 when he retired and he didn't want to retire, but you know, uh, the administration was ready to make a change. I think he's still pissed off about it, but yeah, he, he, uh, he gave back, he gave back for a long, long time.

20:17Speaker 5:The term Nepo baby now gets thrown around a lot in 2026. And I honestly, the fact that it's seen as anything other than a natural progression of what you have learned by your parents through watching them. So I really don't understand the negativity. What are your feelings on it since it has become such a point of conversation?

20:39Speaker 3:So, you know, I have opinions to which I think I'm entitled and I understand everyone has. I think that it's a term that can be used accurately in certain circumstances, certainly as someone who would be, you know, if it's a pejorative, you know, from from where I sit, I'm like, well, hang on a second. I'm showing up and doing my job. Yeah. But there are I think there are circumstances where. it's applicable. You know, we, I mean, here we go. If we're going to go, if we're going to go along, we live in a culture that is highly divided, uh, along a lot of different lines, uh, you know, without getting too deep into the weeds. Uh, it's, it's, it's evident that it behooves certain members of society to help sow division amongst, uh, people who have differences from other people.

21:28Speaker 3:And so, uh, you know, the, the more, um, friction there is, uh, within the, um, I would say classes, the better. So yeah, so it's certainly a term that could be used accurately and correctly to describe certain scenarios. Does it apply to me?

21:50Speaker 2:Sure, it does.

21:51Speaker 3:But like, do you want to go to a cobbler whose parents and grandparents were cobblers?

21:56Speaker 2:You know what I mean?

21:57Speaker 9:Of course.

21:58Speaker 3:Your feet are going to feel better.

22:01Speaker 1:Absolutely.

22:03Speaker 3:Who knows?

22:03Speaker 1:Couldn't agree with you more.

22:05Speaker 5:Your first job was at nine in the TV movie Lois Gibbs and the Love Canal.

22:11Speaker 3:Not as gnarly as it sounds. Actually, gnarlier. Gnarlier, okay. It's based on, so Love Canal was a toxic waste site in New Jersey in the early, early 80s. And there was a woman named Lois Gibbs. Who went about, you know, suing the federal government. So this is like an Aaron Brockovich style. Oh, yeah, absolutely. So it's a movie that week that starred Marsha Mason. And it and it covered the actual terrible stuff that went on in this housing development called Love Canal. And, you know, how she went about getting some some changes made and some recompense for the families who had been affected. by the toxic waste. Although it does sound like a movie you might have seen on Cinemax. Exactly.

23:00Speaker 5:It does.

23:01Speaker 9:It's a red shoe diary.

23:02Speaker 2:Yeah, it's a red shoe diary.

23:04Speaker 3:Nice. Yes, we are around the same age.

23:06Speaker 2:Very good.

23:08Speaker 5:So what are your memories from your first experience on your own set?

23:12Speaker 3:So I didn't get the part that I auditioned for.

23:14Speaker 4:Okay.

23:16Speaker 3:Which is a recurring theme throughout the rest of the show. But I did get a part in it, and it was great. It was a phenomenal experience. It was nice to go to work. It was nice to join the club, as it were. Sean had started a couple of years prior. My mom had done a movie the week wildly called Please Don't Hit Me, Mom. And ABC asked if she would like Sean to play her son. And he was game and she was game. And so he went to work on a movie of the week called Please Don't Hit Me Mom.

23:49Speaker 9:Don't Hit Me Mom.

23:51Speaker 3:Which is like if you read the books, it's actually pretty gnarly. But anyway, I went to go visit him on the set one day and he had a fantastic set teacher. He had a really, really terrific set teacher who at the location had set up a scavenger hunt in the backyard. I think he was trying to teach Sean how to use a compass. Cool. So like there were clues spread throughout the backyard. There were a certain number of paces east, northeast or whatever, whatever, whatever.

24:15Speaker 10:Wow.

24:15Speaker 3:And I was like, man, that looks like fun. And also he was getting a lot of attention from a lot of different people. So I was like, man, that looks like fun. And so I asked my folks if I too could join the troupe and they reluctantly, perhaps more reluctance from my dad than my mom. They reluctantly said, yeah, go for it. But you have to wait until you're a little bit older. And a couple of years later, I was able to audition and get that job with Marsha Mason. Wow. And it was great. It was a terrific time. I know I really upset the prop guy.

24:46Speaker 3:That's one of my strongest memories. So the character that I play passed away. It's based on a real kid who passed away from leukemia because of the toxic waste site. Oh my God. Like the understory is just awful. Yeah. Here we are in showbiz going, ba-ba-da-ba-ba. Wow. So the prop guy was like, there's a scene where the lead character picks up a baseball glove that belonged to the now deceased young man. So the prop guy said, hey, sign this with your character's name. And I went to town on it. I had nice penmanship. I made it look very terrific and legible and nice and all that stuff.

25:23Speaker 3:And the prop guy was like, oh, man, this is too good. This doesn't look like a kid's signature.

25:28Speaker 8:Right, right, right.

25:29Speaker 3:He was very upset with it. And I was, well, I'm still upset that he was upset. Yeah. I think we just found an origin story.

25:36Speaker 2:Now, I have a question.

25:39Speaker 4:When you were growing up, obviously, with your whole family being in the business, did you look at television and film more as, could you lose yourself in it and enjoy it?

25:49Speaker 2:Or were you looking at it more like, oh, this is what my family does?

25:52Speaker 3:Depends. Great question. Depends. You know, there are, and this still applies. There are certain films and television shows that are capable of casting the spells. Where disbelief is entirely suspended and you're all in. I would say the majority of stuff that I watch now, and certainly when I was younger, the majority of the time I was like, ooh, how many setups did they do that day? Right. Oh, that looks like it was looped. Ooh, is his eyeline correct? Yeah.

26:21Speaker 3:Stuff like that, which- which I think is a function of, you know, knowing how the sausage is made.

26:26Speaker 4:Yeah. Well, I mean, is there one style you gravitated towards when you said you wanted to be in the business? Did you want to be in movies or did you want to be like, I want to be on a sitcom and hear the audience?

26:36Speaker 3:That's funny. No, I mean, I think we all wanted to be Harrison Ford. Like there's, there's no, there's no doubt about that. I think, I think we all still want to be Harrison Ford or, you know, Peter Sellers or, you know, somebody, I mean, so that's actually, it's kind of a, two very different genres. But yeah, when I was little, I think it was, it was, you know, Indiana Jones and Han Solo, like that guy. That's the guy to be. Yeah.

27:02Speaker 5:Well, then at just 12 years old, you are cast as Andy Moffat on the sitcom, The Facts of Life.

27:08Speaker 3:That's a true story.

27:09Speaker 5:Surrounded by cool, beautiful older girls.

27:13Speaker 9:And it was already a successful show.

27:16Speaker 5:This is what every young actor living at the Oakwoods dreamt of.

27:21Speaker 9:Just. Do you remember the audition?

27:24Speaker 4:I do.

27:26Speaker 3:Yeah, actually, I do. And this will dovetail nicely with the Nepo baby question because the director, John Boab, was a guy that had worked with my mom previously. So I was not unfamiliar with him. And I think my mom took me to the final callback, the network test. And so there was some comfort there. I remember I don't remember the audition itself. I don't remember, you know, going in and reading the scenes. But I do remember I do remember the elevator on the way out because Boab came out and my mom and I were still waiting for the elevator. And John Boab gave my mom a wink. As if to say, you know, like he's going to get the part. Yeah, which was really a delightful thing. And is absolutely fodder for the people who are angry about Necro babies. Of course.

28:17Speaker 2:Had you seen the show before you auditioned for it?

28:19Speaker 3:Oh, for sure. Yeah. Are you kidding me? Like, yeah, I was I was very excited to have the opportunity to go to go to work with those beautiful women.

28:28Speaker 4:And yes, were you were you more Blair? Were you more Tootie? Were you more Joe? Who did you like on Facts? Who was your character?

28:35Speaker 3:It's impossible to pick a favorite. It's hard to say. I think there are aspects and attributes of every single one of those women that were attractive to a young man and adolescent boy. What would you do if I told you I had the hots for Mrs. Garrett?

28:55Speaker 10:Oh, yeah.

28:56Speaker 9:I'd go, girls, girls, girls.

28:59Speaker 3:No, I did not. I did not. As long as we're feeding the anti-Nepo baby folks. My dad had also done the show earlier. I think it was earlier that season. He had come on and played a romantic interest of Charlotte Ray's.

29:15Speaker 4:Wow.

29:16Speaker 3:I think they met at a– at like a hotel in the Catskills. He was playing the piano there and they had a brief romance or whatever. But in truth, well, my dad and Charlotte both appeared on Broadway together in like 1958. Wow. It was my dad's first Broadway show. So they had known each other, you know, since almost before television. So it was, you know, again, there was a nice welcome into the show because, you know, people were familiar.

29:47Speaker 2:Was that your first time on a sitcom in front of an audience of that style?

29:51Speaker 3:Yeah, definitely. Yeah, I think all the jobs I had before that were single camera.

29:55Speaker 4:Yeah. And did you, how did you, we always like to ask, like, how did you, how did you feel kind of moving into that new version of acting where it's the hybrid kind of situation between film and plays?

30:05Speaker 3:So, I mean, I think I was lucky in that I was young enough to not understand how effing scary it is to be on stage in front of a few hundred people. And I think I was also young enough and wanted enough to do a good job, to not do a bad job, that I was prepared for the experience. I know, yeah, so I don't have any, I have a couple recollections of um, of experiences where, uh, where I, you know, I screwed up in front of the audience. Um, but early on, I don't have any, I don't have any sort of negative stuff that, that comes up. I think it was just a matter of, you know, performing the scene and, you know, it, it didn't matter. I don't think it, I mean, you know, certain stuff mattered in some ways it was a little bit more freedom doing a four camera show because, uh, you were covered, you know what I mean? You had, you had a, you could, you could move fluidly on stage.

31:01Speaker 3:rather than having to stay within the confines of a certain lens. Right.

31:06Speaker 6:Also, the irony is when you mess up in front of the audience, they usually love it because that's what they're there for. They want to see the actors mess up because otherwise it's too, yeah.

31:14Speaker 3:Precisely, precisely. Yeah, the one time, I mean, it's a couple of different times, obviously, but there was one show, because we would do two, we'd tape two shows a night, as I'm sure you guys did as well. And there would be rewrites between shows. And there was one week where there was a particular line that I had that had been rewritten. They wanted to try a different joke. And, you know, at lunch or dinner, essentially, they go over the changes and you get the new line, the new pages, whatever. And, you know, you commit that to memory. It wasn't that much.

31:45Speaker 3:But for some reason, I was distracted and I sort of forgot that they had changed that line until we were in the scene, you know, on stage in front of the audience, you know, cameras rolling. Uh, and I was in like, in my head, I was like, Oh, Oh, it's coming up. And it's something different. It's something different. And what is it? What is it? What is when, you know, uh, luckily at the last minute, the, the new line, uh, you know, came to me. Uh, but there's that it's the live audience is a different animal and there's. And it's– I'm sure you guys would agree.

32:16Speaker 3:It's arguably better in some ways energetically. Like there is an exchange of energy that is palpable and can be really, really valuable. I think there's certain stuff that is better not in front of a live audience, certain intimate stuff. And I don't mean physically intimate but like emotionally intimate. vulnerable stuff is, I think, can be better with fewer people around.

32:42Speaker 2:Yeah, well, Please Don't Hit Me, Mom is a terrible sitcom.

32:45Speaker 3:Oh, boy.

32:45Speaker 2:Yeah, terrible four-camera sitcom.

32:48Speaker 8:Oh, my God. Funny now.

32:52Speaker 3:Oh, man, oh, man. Somewhere, I'm sure, in interviews at some places, or maybe if– I mean, I imagine you guys have come across Sean in your travels. When he tells the story of working– He tells such an incredible story about working on that set, about an experience with our mom that was interesting.

33:15Speaker 9:I can't wait. We have to ask him about that.

33:18Speaker 3:Yeah, it's good stuff. It's his story. So you'll let him tell. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

33:35Speaker 1:How did you deal with being a teen idol in all the magazines?

33:39Speaker 3:I had a ball.

33:40Speaker 9:It was great.

33:43Speaker 3:It was terrific. I was happy to open them up and say, oh, look, there's a picture of me there. Oh, look, there's a picture of me there. It was phenomenal. I had the good fortune to have an example set by my mom and her experience as a child actor, wherein she felt like she missed out on a lot of her childhood. There were Seminal events that most kids have that were not available to her because she was busy doing a television show that bore her name. So when the Facts of Life wrapped in, I think it was early 88, I made the decision to go back to high school as a normal kid, like to go full time back to high school and try to have a normal existence. And it was great because all of the big head, ego-driven, I'm so fancy, check out my Adidas sweater in this week's issue of 16 Magazine, got shot down right away. High school will level the plane for you.

34:47Speaker 3:I found out in no uncertain terms that my caca has an aroma. And it was great. It was great because it, you know, crammed my head back into my skull.

35:01Speaker 8:Yeah.

35:02Speaker 3:In a good way, in a healthy way. Yeah.

35:04Speaker 5:Were there any roles that you almost got that still haunt you?

35:09Speaker 3:I mean, how long is the show? Yeah, right.

35:13Speaker 8:Exactly.

35:14Speaker 3:Let's go year by year. So, 89. God, there's so many. Like, yeah, it would have been nice to be in Stand By.

35:21Speaker 8:Me, sure.

35:22Speaker 1:Yes.

35:22Speaker 3:Right. But what I have come to over the years is that they hired the right guy. Yeah. They hired the right guy. Somewhere out there exists my audition for the part that Leonardo DiCaprio played in What's Eating Gilbert Grape. Oh. And I can promise you, he did a better job. Somewhere is my audition for Primal Fear. And guess what, folks? Edward Norton was the right guy to hire. So like, yeah, there's a ton of jobs that I didn't get that I was lucky enough to audition for. But I can promise the world they hired the right guy.

35:59Speaker 4:Now, I'm sorry.

36:00Speaker 2:I'm just curious.

36:01Speaker 4:With your brother, both of you working all the time– Weird sibling rivalry. Were you ever up for the same stuff?

36:08Speaker 3:So that hasn't actually been too much of a bugaboo. When we were smaller, thankfully, when we were smaller, I mean, I think a couple of times it's come up. But when we were smaller children, we were into separate paradigms. You know, film and television had a much larger paradigm. chasm between them, uh, in the, in the eighties. And so he was a film actor and I was a television actor and, and never the twain, uh, shall meet. Um, after, uh, I finished high school and threw my hat back in the acting ring, uh, and, and got, uh, uh, got a couple of movies. Then we moved closer to maybe possibly be competing for the same role, but like, are they going to hire Abbott or are they going to hire Costello? It's like, there's, there's, there's, I think there's enough of a physical difference between us that, that it, you know, it's, it's one way or another. And now it's like, not even a contest. Like the guy is like an international superstar. So like, we're not, we're not going up for the same roles anymore.

37:08Speaker 5:One role of yours we definitely want to talk about from this time is a movie that has developed a massive cult following over the years called 1987's garbage pale kids movie.

37:19Speaker 3:I hope those people are seeking help.

37:22Speaker 1:It's an acid trip of sorts.

37:25Speaker 5:Were you collecting the cards when you heard about the movie?

37:28Speaker 1:Because this must have been a big deal to book.

37:31Speaker 3:So, I mean, it was in my head. It certainly felt like it was going to be better than it turned out to be. You know, the cards, like the big, my whole take on this is a whole take and you're going to need more tape. But like in the big picture, It's an amazing example of how the commercialization and commodification of anything that has cultural attention can be the worst possible thing for it. So as you remember, or as you probably remember, the cards were sort of based– were based on the popularity of the Cabbage Patch Kids, right?

38:13Speaker 3:Cabbage Patch Kids went through the moon, over the moon, through the roof.

38:18Speaker 1:Through the roof and over the moon.

38:20Speaker 3:That's right. Were very popular, right? This was the first footage I remember seeing of people clamoring over one another to get the last one to give to their kids so they would be considered a good parent.

38:31Speaker 4:I have three adopted children that I've legally adopted somewhere in the world that I haven't seen since I was eight.

38:36Speaker 2:Cause you have to take the oath and do all that kind of stuff.

38:39Speaker 3:You got three.

38:39Speaker 4:Yeah.

38:40Speaker 2:One of them was an astronaut. Say like a rich kid, man. I don't know where they are.

38:46Speaker 3:So, so, so, so Art Spiegelman and John, Oh man, I'm embarrassed. I'm not remembering, uh, the other artists name, these guys, um, took the opportunity to take the piss out of the commercialization and commodification of these little dolls. And so on a whim, they submitted to, you know, I think it was Topps, they submitted the boards for these cards, these kids that were a direct assault on the Cabbage Patch Kids. I mean, obviously the arrangement of the face is super similar and so on, but the opposite of what the, God, is it Xavier– god, I think that is the name of the designer.

39:28Speaker 2:It was Xavier something because Xavier is on the butt. It's like stitched on the butt of the thing.

39:32Speaker 3:So it was a direct assault on that kind of perfect little baby thing. And so it was counterculture. It was artists saying, look, what we're doing here with money and commerce is a little bit insane. So here's, we're going to, you know, throw something disgusting at you guys in this framework. And of course the kids went nuts for it because like it's gross and wow, that says fart and look at this drawing and that's crazy. So then Topps, the trading card company decided to capitalize on the popularity of the cards by rushing to produce a major motion picture. Yes. Now what's unfortunate is that the level of artistry behind the cards is is reflected nowhere in the film.

40:20Speaker 8:Right, yeah.

40:22Speaker 3:The screenplay is not fantastic. The execution is subpar. It has made for, from my perspective, it has made for a terrific example of how the 80s and capitalism and commercialism and show business and marketing and the rampant politics hustle for more money, more money, can fail.

40:49Speaker 2:Right.

40:49Speaker 9:And destroy art.

40:50Speaker 4:Yeah.

40:51Speaker 3:Right. So, like, that's the thing. There's an incredible article that if people are adept at the Internet, they can find with an interview with the director of the Garbage Pail Kids. It's a guy named Rod Amato, who was tons of fun to work with and was a decent guy and was good to everybody. So, like, I'm not casting aspersions.

41:07Speaker 8:Mm-hmm.

41:08Speaker 3:But he says in this interview, he goes, I was a money job. I was trying to make my my health care like I had to I had to make sure I got my coverage. So like, you know, like they didn't it's it's crazy how how much of the stuff that went into the reasons why the Garbage Pail Kids is such a weird movie.

41:25Speaker 1:Yeah.

41:26Speaker 3:Are also applicable now without stepping on any toes or, you know, opening any conversations that.

41:32Speaker 6:My turn off listeners.

41:35Speaker 3:But when I was making it, I was like, this is the greatest thing ever. Look at how terrific this costume is.

41:40Speaker 8:I know.

41:41Speaker 1:What do you remember about those costumes?

41:43Speaker 3:They're weird.

41:45Speaker 7:Yeah, weird.

41:45Speaker 6:Just weird.

41:47Speaker 3:So weird. They were really weird. I remember the little people, the actors that were, you know, trapped in them were heroic every day. We were shooting in the San Fernando Valley in the middle of summer in a converted warehouse on Laurel Canyon and like Cohasset or something way north there. There was an AC. They had those giant tubes, you know, attached to an HVAC outside. And then, you know, the actors would take off these 40 pound helmets that are made of latex with servos all running through it, through which they couldn't really see.

42:22Speaker 11:And, you know, get hosed off with air so they didn't die while we were, you know, slapping together this motion picture to capitalize on something that was making fun of capitalism.

42:33Speaker 5:I do want to give a shout out to my friend, Nick Rosito's mom, who was messy Tessie.

42:38Speaker 3:Yes. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. Oh, that's so good. Yeah. When you tell Nick that I love his mom, she was so good. She was so good to me. She was like, She was probably the closest thing to a mom that there was on that set. She was so good to me.

42:53Speaker 2:So wonderful.

42:54Speaker 3:Susan. Yeah, Susan, thank you. That's incredible. Yeah. I mean, so really what I remember from the production is how hard– Every single one of those little people actor worked to make it happen. Kevin Thompson and Phil Fondacaro. Yes.

43:10Speaker 2:Kevin was on our show.

43:11Speaker 9:Kevin Thompson.

43:12Speaker 2:Kevin was one of our standards.

43:14Speaker 3:How great is Kevin? How great is Kevin?

43:16Speaker 5:Yeah.

43:17Speaker 1:Just amazing.

43:18Speaker 9:Yeah.

43:19Speaker 5:So much of our podcast has been looking back at our own acting careers, which we all petered out on for different reasons. Now we focus on different parts of the industry, but looking back on it is wild.

43:32Speaker 1:Do you feel like you, do you feel like you get it now?

43:36Speaker 9:Like, have you found peace with it all?

43:37Speaker 5:Because we could suggest doing a four years of a podcast.

43:41Speaker 4:If not.

43:42Speaker 3:Well, I mean, I'm glad, I'm glad that we're getting here because, because, you know, earlier today or last week I was thinking, I wonder how much Dr. Special Friedel and Strong would like to discuss what it is that we, that we're all going through. So like, I have a really good life. Yeah. I'm extraordinarily fortunate. I, I, my rent is paid at least until maybe I think next June.

44:13Speaker 7:Okay.

44:14Speaker 3:Uh, you know, I, I, I have a car, I have food in the refrigerator. Uh, I, I'm, I'm, I'm good. I, I'm very lucky. I'm very, very lucky. Yeah. Am I at peace is a difficult question. And I, and I think that that's something that, um, that befalls anyone who, who goes out to Hollywood and, And tries to give this a shot because you predicate. I think it's possible for you to predicate your own sense of value on someone else's sense of value. And it's really hard in my French opinion to remember your intrinsic human value when you don't get the job and then you don't get the job and you don't get the job. get the job and you don't get the job and you see somebody you know that you know that they get the job no it's nice for them but you don't get the job and so so i i think it could be really tough for folks um i think it'd be really tough for folks to to i mean you know i look at jenny lewis i think jenny lewis is one of the prime examples of someone who knew she was she had a she had more to give and walked the heck away from an acting career that was, you know, not bad. She was, she was working and

45:34Speaker 3:she had stuff going on and, and allowed herself to, to, to, to become who she is, you know? And, and like how much more value has she put into the world as a singer songwriter? Like, come on. It's, you know, so, so I, I think she, she's a perfect example of me as someone who broke the mold and found something that was, you know, More true to what calls her. I think there are those of us in this business that can can really get sandbagged by the feeling that you didn't succeed. Yeah. You know what I mean? And like what is success in this business? Right. Like that's such a difficult question to answer because, you know, I look at I look at Sean is obviously ridiculously successful.

46:19Speaker 3:Sean is Sean has done it right. But there are aspects of Sean's life that I think are much more difficult than than they are for me. Like I can go navigate through the world like a normal human being. And, and, and there's not, you know, it's, it's not like my parents' experience. It's not like Sean experience, you know, like I go to the bank, nobody gets, you know what I mean? Like I get cut in front of the line of Jersey Mike's and you know, that's how it happens. Like that's life. Right. So, so there's value in having an experience that is more closely related to the experiences of, of others. Yeah.

46:54Speaker 4:Sure.

46:54Speaker 3:Yeah. I feel like I'm, I'm successful at that.

46:57Speaker 8:Yeah.

46:59Speaker 2:Dude, you've got like 250 credits.

47:01Speaker 3:You're successful. 250?

47:02Speaker 9:Wait a minute. Is that IMDb Pro?

47:07Speaker 8:I should get that.

47:07Speaker 2:We've got that one.

47:08Speaker 3:We've done a lot of shit.

47:10Speaker 2:We can't afford IMDb Pro, so.

47:12Speaker 3:We've done a lot of shit.

47:14Speaker 4:It's a write-off.

47:17Speaker 3:You should just give it to us. Well, yeah, to answer, you know, after another like internally long sentence, which is the Also congenital. At peace, I think at times. I'm at peace with the work that I did and where I am. But I'm also capable of being deeply, deeply embarrassed by some of the clothes in the 80s.

47:43Speaker 2:They were the best, weren't they?

47:47Speaker 1:Gotta embrace it.

48:01Speaker 5:Well, adult Mackenzie has been involved in so many incredible TV shows. Listeners may recognize you from The Magicians or Homeland or Netflix's You or Mad Men or Lost.

48:14Speaker 9:The list goes on and on.

48:16Speaker 5:But this past year, you have really hit a streak on TV's hottest shows, The Pit, Landman and Mayor of Kingstown.

48:26Speaker 3:Yeah. Yeah. I've been very, very lucky. I've been very, very lucky. The pit was such a good get. That was such a good get. You know, what's funny, it's like when you read them all together like this, it's like, oh, I am kicking ass. There's like eight months between that and like six months between this and like a year between that. And so like, oh, you know, what's the word as a composite? It's like, oh, yeah, kick ass. But then there's those times between where you're like. Yeah.

48:52Speaker 3:Someone going to like me. I mean, technically is, am I going to be right for the job, which is really what it comes down to. You're either the right guy for the job or you're not the right guy for the job.

49:02Speaker 1:Right.

49:03Speaker 3:You refer back to the audition for.

49:07Speaker 1:The project you auditioned for, but they didn't get that part.

49:09Speaker 3:Any of them. Go on, name one. Yeah. The pit was great. The pit was a great get. I was really lucky to, jump in with those guys as they were just beginning what has become a pretty darn successful journey.

49:21Speaker 1:Oh, yeah.

49:22Speaker 5:I mean, and you were in a heartbreaking storyline. It seems like the type of challenge you hope for as an actor.

49:29Speaker 3:Yeah.

49:30Speaker 5:What is it like dealing with that type of rapid fire intensity and gut wrenching drama?

49:36Speaker 1:Is it challenging?

49:37Speaker 3:Well, I mean, it can be. Yeah, sure. Like there are aspects of it that can be. That show in particular did a fantastic job of creating an environment that was very, very supportive of the work that Rebecca Tilley and I were tasked with. And, you know, it just– It was easier than it might have been on a different production. But there was just so much respect from Noah, from Amanda Marsalis, who directed the more gravitational– no, that's not right. The more gravity– the episodes with more gravity. Yeah. So, yeah.

50:20Speaker 3:So it was definitely easier to do our jobs than it might have been if those scenes were on Love Boat. Right.

50:26Speaker 4:Yeah.

50:27Speaker 3:But, you know, and also, like, you know, props to the production designer and set deck because that set is so realistic that after, you know, a few hours, it really feels like you're in a hospital. Right. Yeah. You go into stage, I think it's 21 at Warner Brothers and, like, it feels like you're in a hospital. It's weird. Oof.

50:51Speaker 1:You have worked with so many big names over the years.

50:54Speaker 5:Who are some of the actors that come to mind immediately when you think of generous or helpful?

51:02Speaker 1:And remember, you did work with Ryder Strong on Pepper Dennis.

51:06Speaker 3:Did we have, I was trying to think. I don't think we had any scenes. I don't think we actually did, right? No.

51:10Speaker 9:Good, then no need to name any.

51:11Speaker 3:Because that would have been like 2006 and I didn't get sober until 2010. So there's some stretches of time there that stuff just sort of blends into other stuff. I don't really, you know what I mean? Like I was what?

51:27Speaker 9:I did what?

51:29Speaker 3:I did what did I do? I mean, that's, again, it's hard to choose a favorite child. Like, you know, Sandra Bullock is a really wonderful person to be around no matter what. Like she's phenomenal. And this is going back 30 years, but she was there. I can't imagine she's changed much.

51:47Speaker 4:Right.

51:48Speaker 3:And was also really gracious with the few scenes that we that we had together. Noah Wiley is another example of someone who's, you know, just gets it, just understands that. Especially in episodic television, because oftentimes it is the guest performers that have to come in and do some crazy. Yeah, the heavy lifting.

52:06Speaker 4:Right.

52:07Speaker 3:To which the regular actors, you know, the regular carry, the regulars respond. But yeah, gosh. How was Costner? Costner was great.

52:19Speaker 6:Was he?

52:19Speaker 3:Okay, cool. Costner was great. That was such a good get. That was a really terrific get. It's a cool scene. It's a cool scene. So that was the very last stuff that they shot on that production. They'd spent six months in Tucson, in the desert, you know, essentially, like with sand and dirt and muck. Well, not muck because it's too dry, but sand and dirt and grit everywhere. And then they filmed the scene that ends the movie Wyatt Earp, and it's on a boat in port, like off the coast, in the Strait of Juan de Fuca, off the coast of... northern Seattle and so everybody was really glad to be there really glad to be out of the dust really glad that the movie was almost finished and like I had I had a couple of magical experiences on just the two days maybe three days that I was there And then he offered me a ride home. That's cool. He was leaving the day we wrapped.

53:09Speaker 3:He's like, hey, I got the jet. Do you want to ride back to Los Angeles?

53:12Speaker 1:And I was like, yep.

53:14Speaker 3:I do.

53:14Speaker 5:Yes, I do.

53:15Speaker 9:That's fine.

53:16Speaker 3:Yeah, thanks.

53:17Speaker 2:Amazing.

53:18Speaker 3:So, yeah, he was great. He was really great. That's good to hear. Yeah, that was a good experience. That's awesome. And, you know, that was one of the parts where it's like there's no acting required. Like basically the character that I was playing is recognizing Wyatt Earp. Yeah. For being this, you know, it's Wyatt Earp. And so like, I'm Matt Gaston, recognizing Kevin Costner. Yeah. Roll camera.

53:39Speaker 5:Yeah, that's cool.

53:40Speaker 3:That's cool.

53:42Speaker 5:What do you hope comes next for you? What is like in your sights? What are you looking to do? We can assume you're going to be working into your 90s.

53:50Speaker 3:So, you know. From your lips to the network's ears.

53:53Speaker 9:So what do you want to tackle next?

53:56Speaker 3:So next I want to get a crown on number 18. The root canal I had done yesterday. I haven't been able to chew on this side of my mouth for a little bit. And I would like this side of my mouth would like to chew too, please.

54:09Speaker 1:Okay.

54:09Speaker 3:Yeah. So that's Monday. Great. Work-wise, you know, like the Holy Grail, the brass ring, I think for anyone, you know, sort of in the working actor, but not working all the time. What is that called? paradigm. No, there's a better word for it. I'll think of it later. Well, you know, the whole, the whole, the brass ring is, is to get a serious wreck, you know what I mean? Is to get a, is to get a consistent gig.

54:37Speaker 9:Yeah.

54:37Speaker 3:To get a role that's, that's meaningful and, and, and, and, and fits your face and your personality on a show that people like on a show that people are interested in seeing three, maybe five seasons of.

54:53Speaker 4:Right. Yeah.

54:53Speaker 3:Well, you know, but I've been, You know, like, if we want to go pie in the sky, like, you know, big cosmic, you know, next. So, like, our business, the act of storytelling, is the oldest form of communication on the planet, right? Like, that's how people are told who we are, who we were, who we can be, and so forth. And, like, you know... My dad's origin story, like how John Astin became an actor, is an incredible story that I really should let him tell. But I will, again, take up probably 45 minutes of your listeners' time telling a story that could be told in four. No, so he had a friend that was going to Worcester College in Ohio when my dad was in Hopkins. And he was going to go out and visit him. And my dad's friend said, hey, come out early. My roommate is in a play. So my dad hitchhiked out to Ohio from Bethesda early and saw a performance, saw the play that this guy's roommate was in. And it was a performance of Our Town, which is a play that your listeners may or may not know. It's a good play.

56:00Speaker 3:It's been around for some time. It's about lots of things, but sort of who we are and what we're doing in this big cosmic soup traveling at the high rate of speed we are. But this particular production had the character of the stage manager, which is seminal to the play, portrayed by Thornton Wilder, the guy that wrote the play.

56:21Speaker 4:Oh, wow.

56:22Speaker 3:This is something that Thornton Wilder did for a little bit. He went around the colleges with Our Town and he played the stage manager.

56:28Speaker 1:Oh, I didn't realize that.

56:29Speaker 3:Yeah, it's pretty incredible. It's a remarkable thing because the play itself can be transformative for people. Questioning... you know, what is all this? And so my dad had this experience where he went into the theater, one person, and he came out a different person. He had what he will describe as a transcendent experience where he recognized that that medium has the power to change who people are. So big picture, I would love to be part of something that helps us understand who we are now and how to get to who we could be later. And I think that there are, you know, there are movies and there are films and there are, you know, television shows.

57:15Speaker 3:There are plays that help, you know, pull people into the present from the past. And, you know, it would be really nice to be a part of something that helps folks evolve.

57:31Speaker 2:That's cool.

57:32Speaker 3:That's a great answer.

57:34Speaker 9:Beautiful answer.

57:35Speaker 3:Yep.

57:36Speaker 1:Thank you so much for spending your time with us today.

57:39Speaker 3:Thank you guys for letting me talk on and on.

57:43Speaker 2:We love that.

57:45Speaker 9:We hung on every word.

57:46Speaker 1:It was wonderful.

57:48Speaker 3:That's very kind, Dr.

57:49Speaker 4:Fishel.

57:49Speaker 3:Thank you very much.

57:51Speaker 4:Dr.

57:51Speaker 9:Austin, it was a pleasure. I really thank you so much for being here.

57:55Speaker 3:Thank you for having me. The pleasure was mine. Thank you. Bye. So great to meet you. Likewise.

57:59Speaker 8:Likewise.

58:00Speaker 3:I'll see you all later.

58:00Speaker 9:See you later.

58:01Speaker 11:Bye.

58:02Speaker 9:Man, what an incredible human being.

58:05Speaker 1:That was awesome.

58:06Speaker 2:I can see. I want to go have lunch with him and just talk for like two hours. Yeah, exactly.

58:10Speaker 9:Man, I really felt like this is a friend.

58:14Speaker 3:And, you know, talk about dismantling the Nepo baby thing. How humble he is. How, like, down to earth.

58:21Speaker 6:He has his head around the industry so well. And is admitting, even when the Nepo baby question, he's admitting, yeah, I'm a Nepo baby. But still able to see it for what that is. And, like, just what a smart, perceptive guy.

58:34Speaker 7:So, yeah.

58:35Speaker 6:Oh, and talented.

58:36Speaker 1:So talented.

58:37Speaker 9:The whole family.

58:38Speaker 2:The whole family is just talented as hell. It's amazing to watch. Not a dud in the bunch.

58:41Speaker 5:That was really one of the most enjoyable interviews we've had in four years. No disrespect to anyone else. We've had lots of amazing interviews, but that is up there for sure.

58:54Speaker 3:Wow. All right.

58:54Speaker 5:Well, thank you all for listening to this episode of Podmeets World. As always, you can follow us on Instagram, podmeetsworldshow. You can send us your emails, podmeetsworldshow at gmail.com. And we've got merch.

59:06Speaker 2:You take the good, you take the bad, you take them all and then you go and buy.

59:10Speaker 8:Some merch.

59:11Speaker 3:You buy some merch.

59:13Speaker 1:Podmeetsworldshow.com. Writer, send us out.

59:16Speaker 3:We love you all.

59:17Speaker 1:Pod dismissed.

59:21Speaker 6:Pod Meets World is an iHeart podcast produced and hosted by Danielle Fishel, Wilfred L., and Ryder Strong. Executive Producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman. Executive in Charge of Production, Danielle Romo. Producer and Editor, Tara Sudbach.

59:33Speaker 2:Producer, Maddie Moore.

59:34Speaker 6:Engineer and Boy Meets World Superfan, Easton Allen. Our theme song is by Kyle Morton of Typhoon. Follow us on Instagram at podmeetsworldshow or email us at podmeetsworldshow at gmail.com.