NDIS Compliance & Auditing Explained: How Australian Providers Can Turn Audits Into a Growth Strategy

0:00It's Sarah. No support workers today. I got Katura. We're back, we're ready. I can't wait to tell everybody in this podcast all the mischief that you're up to. So let's just crack a like and let's get straight into it. What? What makes you start a business in this sector out of all crazy sectors? Of all the things to do, I know. Look, I fell into the sector nearly 20 years ago and have been working for a variety of organizations since then. And look, I think it was one of those things I'd, I'd always wanted to do something myself. I'd always wanted to start my own business, but the timing was never right.

0:38There was always something else going on, usually in my own life rather than in my work life, that just meant that it wasn't the right time for me to do it. And then funnily enough, it was life circumstances that that ended up being the instigator for me actually making the move when I did, which was, you know, just over 18 months ago now. Yeah. Just just really looking at trying to find some balance. I worked for an amazing organization who were really supportive and really flexible, but I was going through some pretty significant stuff in my life.

1:12I was diagnosed with a chronic condition. I have neurodivergent kids, and my eldest was just about to start high school. And so timing, I just kind of felt like I was doing really great in the organization that I was working for, but felt like I had all these diva demands that I was kind of trying to, you know, I was, I was asking for a lot of flexibility, which they were happy to give. But there was still something inside of me that was just like, you know, I really feel like I'm stretching the friendship a little bit. And I had the opportunity, I had some really great support around me to be able to step back from a nine to five will be at a flexible 9:00 to 5:00 and to be able to focus on on me and my family a bit more.

1:55But I'm not very good at not doing anything. So in that moment, in those quieter moments whilst I was focusing on myself, I started a business. Just as you do. In your quiet moments. It's like when everything comes out for me, I've done the same like you. It's kind of like that pivot, pivot moment that you've gotten. It's like that jump start that you kind of needed that you didn't, even at times I didn't even know I needed, but I got it anyway. Yeah, absolutely. Yep.

2:25It's the, it's the universal push in the right direction that just sort of everything happened so that it was the right time really. So when you were working inside the organization organisations, what problems keep showing up and again and again that you just have to tackle? Look, I think really in a lot of cases it comes down to organisations having systems that are designed for compliance, not designed for successful business management or business growth or not designed for them specifically.

2:57So in a lot of cases I've either worked for in my own business or or worked for organisations when I was when I was working as an employee where there's a lot of additional work that's in place or that needs to happen. A lot of busy work that's happening in the back end to try and make the systems that have been implemented really work and really provide the value that they can do for, you know, that really strong foundation that organisations need to build from.

3:26And I think sometimes when their systems that have been put in place is a catch all from a compliance perspective, sometimes they're the wrong size for the organization, they're the wrong fit. And it's like that, you know, when you try on clothes that are one-size-fits-all, they either don't fit because you're not the size that they anticipated when they created it, or they have to be big enough to fit most people. And therefore you end up with all these extra material that's flapping about in the breeze.

3:57And I think it's a similar thing with with quality systems where you end up with superfluous policies or procedures or registers or, or systems or processes that you then have to manage as an organization but are actually not helpful for you at all. They're just creating more work. They don't make you more compliant, but I think people get scared that if they refine or reduce things that they'll end up cutting off compliance in the process. So it's finding that balance and really creating systems that have built for you that are built for the organization.

4:31Is it kind of cool because you get to be like, wait, hold up, there's a better way. Follow me Like do do you get to do things like? That yeah, absolutely. And look, I think it can be really liberating. I think there's a lot of fear mongering in the sector around compliance and around, you know, the auditors are coming and I've been an auditor before and I don't think I'm overly scary, but I, I accept that, you know, I, I can see why it's a nerve racking process, but I think being able to show people that it doesn't have to be that scary.

5:06And I think a lot of that comes from them understanding the value of the systems that are in place and making them value, but making them more than just a tick box process, which is where the value is for each individual organization, for each provider. It is funny, you're right, because people like, Oh no, the auditors are coming And, and I, I, maybe I've always had that mindset. Well, they should be able to audit my paperwork any day of the week.

5:31And if I'm not happy with and there's a problem that makes any sense, like I love auditing like I, it sounds so cheesy, but I did because then I was like, well, where do I sit on the benchmark? Like is am I hey low? Like what am I working towards? I didn't have like any KPIs on it or any crap like that, but I was just more curious of where my work could lead me. Do you find that people get excited about audit? Like is there a percentage of people that enjoy auditing? I am one of those people.

5:57I like to think there are other people out there. So you've made me feel good that I'm not alone. Look, I think there are, and I think there are more, probably more people that actually feel that way than they realize. I think there are a lot of people that are stuck in that, that anxiety, that fear around it, where if they actually switched their mindset about it and went, this is actually an opportunity for me to showcase what I do, for me to go check out all the awesome stuff that we do here.

6:26These are our clients, these systems that we use to help us. This is how we find out what's working and what's not. These are the cool things we've changed because people gave us feedback and instead of going, instead of seeing it as a test, see it as AI say performance. But yeah, as a showcase, as as an opportunity, and then people come back and go, there's a bit of a gap here, you know, Or have you considered doing it this way? There's there's opportunities for improvement. And of course, there are things that you have to be compliant with.

6:56We can't get around it. But there's no one formula. There's no one recipe for that. And when people feel empowered to be able to apply their own culture, their own real values of their organization, what they want to these systems, they become some something so much different than something that someone else created that you're going to come and get tested on. It's less of a test, yeah. Well, I feel like it's a really good opportunity to explore your teamwork that you've got because you've all got to be in it together.

7:26Like there is that. It's kind of like a Henry Ford factory where everyone plays a role to get to get to your policies and procedures, making sure that they're in line. And you need us all to work together to see that it is going where it's meant to be going. We're doing what we're meant to be doing and when we succeed it, we all party, we all celebrate. It's because we followed what we needed to do to be successful. Yeah, absolutely. It's that, you know, everybody coming together as a community and working towards it.

7:53I liken it to work health and safety quality being similar in that it doesn't just sit with one or a few people in the organization. You can't actually be successful at it if you don't have systems built in and the understanding across the organization that means that people know what their role is in it. Policies and procedures don't make you compliant. People who are having access to policies and procedures that guide how they work every day, that are useful and valuable to them to be able to go to and go.

8:23Now I understand where I begin and end because I've got access to these cool things that that tell me what's expected of me and that give me some really cool guidelines to work within and actually doing that and understanding them. That's where compliance is. You know, it's, it's whilst there's all of these, you know, things that happening in the background. It really happens with each individual in an organization understanding how they contribute really. Well, it makes me also think because you interview external, you interview our stakeholders, they're our people that we serve as well.

8:56Get interviewed during the process. Some people are a bit nervous about that. I'm, I dare say that we're on the same page here, but I find like this is a really opportunity to empower somebody for the services that they have. Have you found that when you've been auditing? Yeah, absolutely. Interviews tend to make everybody a bit nervous, whether that's participants who've been who've who've opted in to be interviewed and and chosen for interview or even workers who end up being part of that interview process.

9:23And I think really what it comes down to is, is being really truthful and honest. And auditors aren't. The job isn't to catch people out. It's not to try and trick people or, you know, that they shouldn't be shouldn't be convoluted questions yet that make you have to rack your brain for answers. And I think some people feel really overwhelmed by thinking that they have to know all of the answers in order to get it right, I guess. And sometimes, you know, for look for clients, participants being involved, really what you want is their honest feedback. If they don't understand how to access your feedback processes or if if they feel like they're, you know, not being heard or there are issues, you want to know those things as a provider, that's gold.

10:14That's where you improve your services for support workers and other people who are involved in interview. Really it's about knowing the information, if you do knowing or knowing where to find it if you don't. So if in order to ask you a question, I don't know, but I know where to go to find it is a really valid response. It's not the wrong answer. It's really showing that you've not only got the information, but when you don't know you've got the right supports and strategies in place, the structure in place to in the right direction.

10:45So with auditing, what has it taught you so far when it comes to life skills outside of auditing? Has it taught you to have really good files on your computer like, or has it given you any skill sets that you've taken outside? 2 days ago my laptop died. I've spent the last, well I spent the 1st 24 hours after it happened trying to fix it and the most recent 24 hours setting up my new laptop because I couldn't fix it. But I did think about it earlier today and go.

11:12I'm so glad I do what I do because I've got everything. I've got all of my data, everything backed up. I've got all of my information there. I don't know how much that comes from auditing per SE, but I mean, yeah, look, I, like I said before, I enjoy auditing. I've audited my own social media use in the past. Yeah. I have, I'll admit it. And I've actually, it resulted in me uninstalling apps from my phone. Yeah, yeah. I did an audit of my Facebook feed based on how many of the posts were actually from people that I knew.

11:46So people who I was connected to directly, how many were sponsored, how many were things that I wasn't interested in at all. And I did. I can't remember how many posts, it was quite a few. It didn't take long to scroll through them all. But what I found was that majority of them were ads and things that I actually wasn't interested in. And very few of them. I think out of about 150 posts I scrolled through, I think there was maybe 3 that were from my friends or family. And maybe it's just because I don't have a lot of connections and my friends and family aren't very active on Facebook, but. It's a, it's a whole thing.

12:22You're right. Because they were saying that a lot more people when it comes to social media are following because what's the point? Yeah, I'll come across your content anyway. So a lot of people don't press the follow button because they'll see it through their feed and they get there a dopamine and then they move on. They don't hold on to you. Yeah, it's interesting. But yes, so absolutely, I use auditing has got a lot has has influenced my life in all sorts of weird and wonderful ways.

12:48I'm a little bit impressed. Thank you, I can send you my results if you'd like. I'll have to see if it makes the benchmark. Review the data. Yeah, absolutely happy to be audited on my social media audit. What gives you the confidence to build your own empire and you know, like to build your own empire? Because not everyone can do it. Look, I think for me it's I see it may be less as an empire and more as a community that grows together. And I think what gives me the confidence to do it is the people that I connect with and that I work with.

13:23And, and knowing that, knowing that I can make a difference and that I can support people, whether that's through them having a better understanding of, of quality management, because it's not a lot of fun in a lot of cases. Like people don't go, yay, tell me more. So if I can frame it in a way that helps people to contextualise it makes it really easy for them to absorb, but also makes it less, less dry, more meaningful and, and actually links it to really good outcomes.

13:54Then I guess that's the thing for me, that's the driver for me. The driver for me is, is helping people and certainly helping people who help people, but a little bit of a, a roadie in that sense. I set up all your equipment and I'll help you tune you tune your guitar. And so do you sound check and stuff for you, you know, But you need to let me know what it is that you want to sing. What? What's on your playlist? What what do you want to sound like as an organization? And I'll help you pull together a really good show. And that I enjoy doing that.

14:30I love doing that. So yeah, for me it's the passion to really help people that's driven me. So I'm sorry, I'm having a giggle because I'm like, if you're the roadie, I must be the groupie. Cool. I like it. I love it. Anyone listening what does quality HQ stand for? In a philosophical way. Go for it. I'm only as. Yeah. Look, it's really about making compliance inevitable rather than making compliance this ongoing goal. It's making, you know, helping organizations to understand quality really well, to understand the value of it and how it improves their organization, their capacity for growth and scale, but growth and scale that is supportive of their workforce and their client outcomes. And so it takes all of these things that people value and their culture and creates A framework that means that that is scalable in their organizations. It doesn't get left behind when they grow. It also doesn't get left behind when the, you know, the sector goes, you'll never guess what.

15:32We're changing this and we're doing this, and we're doing the other thing because it's your structure. Yeah. Oh, look, there's still tweaks that need to be made. But when it's your structure that you've created that you've got confidence in, there's really less of a panic because you understand where those changes integrate with the system that you've got, because you know your system, you know your framework. And so for you, for organizations that have got it in place, making those changes when they hit is it doesn't feel like a complete restructure because they've got that foundation in place. So really, yeah, it is really about helping people. You said before you were talking about people having these aha moments.

16:12I mean, that's what I kind of, that's what I live for is, is helping people have aha moments. Is it like when you talk about aha moments? Is it really cool getting when you first start with a small provider and then slowly watching them scale to where they are today? Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. And I think, you know that, that watching people's confidence grow, you know, just in, in their, you know, their systems and their structure, but in their mindset as well. Yeah.

16:39And that confidence that comes with that is yeah, is great. That's why I do it. Yeah, absolutely. Would be really a rewarding and then because in the beginning people need you more and then as time progresses it just slowly, gradually drifts away, if that makes any sense. Because in the beginning is always hard. Yeah, Oh, percent. And I've said, you know, my, my goal in my job is to do myself out of a job, which doesn't sound like a great business model, let's be honest.

17:06But my goal is, is not to make people dependent on me. My goal is to make people independent and have the capacity and the confidence and the understanding and structure built in their organization that that they can run with so they don't need to keep coming back to me, that they slowly create this capacity internally. That means that, yeah, I can release them into the wild. Is there like any like is there anything that providers make a mistake on commonly that you see as when it comes to it? Oh look, probably the biggest things that I see providers get stuck on or feel stuck on a policies and procedures 2 two things policies and procedures risk. That that's why, you know, we're all support workers at play, right?

17:54We we enjoy people. Exactly. Well, absolutely, I thought. We do best. Totally get it, who wants policies and procedures? But yeah, look, I think in a lot of cases and in the sector that we've we're in, a lot of providers have purchased their policies and procedures. And whilst I understand why they often end up with policies and procedures that are similarly to what I said before, they're they've been created to as a catch all and they've been created specifically for compliance, not for your organization, not for your culture, not for your systems, not for the way you want to run your organization. And in a lot of cases, they're purchased with these caveats built in, like whatever you do, don't change them or they won't be compliant.

18:39And the, the reality is, is if you don't change them, they're not compliant. Not that if you do, but there's again, coming back to that fear that people have of not, of either not being compliant in the 1st place or undoing something that was compliant. It's that I don't know what, I don't know problem. But I think organizations have really busy policy and procedure manuals that they're responsible for reviewing and updating, but that they actually don't know where to begin and end. It's like, what do I review and update it? I know it's compliant.

19:09I've been told not to touch it. I'm a little bit worried about it, but also they end up with all of these this dispersed workforce that are out there doing these amazing things, but that if they don't have a solid policy and procedure suite of documents to guide them are constantly on the phone to different people. Hey, I've got a client that needs I need, I need, I need. How do I, how do I and if they could create that really solid document suite to support them, that's their go to. It's, it's kind of like they're, you know, it's their song sheet, it's the lyrics that they go to.

19:44So everyone's singing the same song. And I think the issue that people have and, and something that I've come up against before is people going, well, you're either person centered or your system centered. And that kind of does my head in a bit because your systems can be person centered. And I think people go, I feel like it's red tape and it's just, you know, there's no person centered if you've got a policy that tells you how to do it, but it's actually. How you create safe person centered services and you support your workers to know where they begin and end so they don't put themselves into situations where they're like, oh, person centered, sure, you can do whatever you like. I'll do whatever you ask, which is really not. That's a massive risk to your organization. It's a massive risk to that worker and it's an even bigger risk to that client.

20:31It's having person centered structure in place. That's really where the gold sits. IA 100% agree because there's if you have a really open-ended one, it means that you could provide support to everybody. And as a provider, we're not a one stop shop like we can't, we have to be particular what we do well and do that well instead of thinking that we could provide support to everybody because everybody that comes through and who we support has all these different disabilities and have different environmental things that we as providers can't always get right and we are not the right provider for it. Yeah.

21:07Absolutely. And you know I said before that the standards aren't a recipe, they're a serving suggestion, right? They don't tell you exactly what needs to go in, they just tell you what they want at the end. This is person centered. Provide person centered services to everyone. How you actually do that is up to you as an organization. And if you've not written down the expectations of your workers in your documentation and that's expectations of practice, but as well as behaviour, how you expect them to be with people. I want you to involve people.

21:39What does involve people look like? Like make it really obvious because then you can be really confident in your organization, having that consistency in your practice, but consistency in culture as well and in in what you're wanting to provide to your, to your clients, not just person centered services to everyone. We're not the Oprah of person centered. So you get person centers, you get person centered services, but there's actually something meaningful behind that so that everybody understands for your organization what person centered services really means in practice.

22:13And that's where it's really valuable. 100% because it's got like it does have a bit of a personality and a language around it. Because I have worked at providers where I felt like I was opening War and Peace and I was like, oh God, this is this is huge. Like, you know, and then I've had others are like, Oh yeah, I get you. And then like they've got, you can see with certain founders the personality that comes out with their policies and procedures and how it in lines with that workplace. Like so when writing them, they can be a little bit of fun. Like you can put things that are really service based into them. Yep, absolutely.

22:47They should be easy to read. They they should be. Yeah, they should be. They're your guiding documents. If if you don't have a conversation or say at least once a week what does our policy say or what does the procedure say, then your policies and procedures aren't written for you. They're not. If you're not referring to them constantly, then you don't have a document suite that's actually valuable for your organization. And that's, yeah, I'd love to help people to be able to transition those. So how do you do it?

23:19Like how do you build like a female LED business in a space that can feel really corporate and really serious and kind of stiff? But being really not corporate and stiff, yeah, look, I think that I think in in Health and Human services. So in the sectors that we work in, I think it lends itself to being more human and and more connected and having better conversations with people. And so I think for me, it really comes down to being myself, being my professional self. But really, part of my approach is to bring humour is to bring. I do a lot of.

23:56Storytelling I didn't pick. A lot of storytelling and analogies and stuff. So I, I don't approach things by, you know, by reading to people from the standards. It's not how I how I my. Favorite sleep time? Book. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, If I want to really put people to sleep, I've got plenty of resources to do that. But yeah, look, I think, I think really it is about it is about having a a different approach that meets that meets people where they are.

24:33A lot of people in our sector aren't corporate and stiff and you know, they they need and that's where they end up feeling a barrier to quality management and compliance is because it feels like that stuffed shirt stuff where you're like, I don't get it, I don't understand it. So where I can make it and put the human into it and help people to contextualize it so that it feels applicable to what they're doing. It feels applicable to the care sector that we're in.

25:04I want to care for people. I don't want to talk about risk, you know, I don't want to write policies. I just want to help people when they can see how these things really support what their goal is. It just makes all the difference. It's also uncovers your ass. Oh yeah. Big time. Like, it's not like I'm very good at, I'm not very good at expressing it, but it really does. Because if you don't have anything in play, then you're an open book. And to allow some terrible things to happen to the people that we provide care to. Yeah.

25:41And it's the, the, you know, unfortunately there's been a lot of stories in the media about organizations and in some cases really well meaning organizations, but that that really highlight the unfortunate part of the story, which is I didn't know not being good enough, not being a solid excuse. You know, that's where, you know, a lot of these systems and strategies are safeguards. Like you said, it really isn't. It's a processing covering my ass. But you also can get fines like through the roof if you don't have things in place.

26:16Like there was a provider and then there's a provider out there that had that somebody had passed away in care and they had to go back and retrain all their staff because they weren't aware of a certain way to support people. And then they will find, yeah, a big amount and fairly so because somebody passed away in care. Yep. Yeah, absolutely. It does happen, it does happen then, and you know, it works both ways as well, creating strategies and frameworks that mean that all of your workers go home to their families everyday life and, you know, not burnt out and in a position to be able to play with their kids and go on a date night with a partner. Is, is also, you know, you've, you've got, when you're running an organization, you, you've got a lot of people, you've got a lot of people that are looking to you. And I recently was, was talking about risk management. You know, we get up in the morning and we majority of us have a hot drink and it's risky, right? If you've ever seen me in a kitchen, I can somehow burn myself on anything.

27:25It's a skill, but I still risk having a hot drink every day. And I could, you know, we've got we put strategies in place. Maybe I put a bit of extra milk in or a little bit of cold water to help me not burn myself on everything because I'm good at it. You know, maybe people like their coffee hotter, but when you're making decisions for yourself to have a hot drink every morning, it's very different to them going. I'm now responsible for all of these workers and all of these clients to all have a hot drink.

27:50And do I have the same appetite for that risk or not? And that's where things become a lot more grey, right? We can make those decisions for ourself, but as you know, as organizations that are supporting our workforce and our clients through, you know, and, and a vulnerable, vulnerable clients who have this supportive workforce that are at risk of certainly at risk of burnout, you know, we're caring. We're a caring sector, you know, and so, so yeah, it's a lot to take on. I feel like for a lot of people when they hear risk management, their eyes just go open because you're like, and then you start looking around like, and this could be a risk and that could be a risk.

28:31And then like it just the overwhelm, like it can be quite overwhelming because you don't realize how many risks there are until you have to write it down. Absolutely, but without highlighting them. And I think, you know, it's, it can feel like an exercise in doomsday sometimes, which can feel really, you know, what's the worst that could happen? Let's write it down and map it out. But in all honesty, it actually creates really interesting conversations. It actually gives you the ability to create really supportive structures for your organization, linking it back to policies and procedures, linking it back to, you know, your systems and your registers and your frameworks that support your organization.

29:11But it's the the difference between having a safety harness on or having an ambulance on site. I'd much prefer to have a harness on and, and you know, just to not fall to my, you know, plummets down to the ground then to be, you know, to be trying to fix things retrospectively. So wherever you can create this proactive harness that is there to provide you with some support so that you don't in the hope that you don't fall means that, you know, you could have the best paramedics on call if I offered you that as a solution. Look, you can have this harness or I'll call an ambulance for you.

29:48Get up to that, you know the top floor and start working. Most people in the right minds, I would think would opt to have a harness if they're going to be working at heights. It's that same. It's creating a harness for you and your organization. It's also giving you informed decision making because you know the process and it maps it out very quick, very easily and very quickly. What what Rd. you need to go down next? Yep. Yeah. And your appetite for that risk, you know, like I said before with the tea and coffee, you know, my my partner used to jump out of airplanes. Hi.

30:24And but that he had an appetite. He was, that was a risk he was willing to take. It's not a risk I'm willing to take and every organization should be aware of their own risk appetite as well, because that drives the strategies you put in place. If your risk appetite is really quite high, maybe you will just have a paramedic on site. That's your organization's risk appetite, you know, or risk appetite might be so low that you might not even let people work at heights. That's really, there's a massive scale of then all of these things come into play.

30:57The different risks, your appetite for them, the strategies that you have available to you as a as an organization and how they all work together to create this really cool supportive framework. Yeah, but it is make people glaze over. Well, you were talking about risk appetite to own a business. It is a risk and you've got to have an appetite to do it. Could you give anyone any like advice that you would have if they were to step out and do their own consultancy?

31:26Look, yes, can I do it? Yeah, invest in coffee, invest in caffeine, caffeinated drinks. No, look, I think really it just comes down to going for it. I think if it's something, yeah, if it's something that you can't stop thinking about, don't stop going for it. Just really you only get one life, so get out there and do it. But you know, do some risk analysis, you know where where your risk appetite is. You know, maybe you financially have, you know, you have different financial risk appetite to the person sitting next to you, but what is your financial risk appetite look like?

32:03I can throw everything into it for the next 6 months, three months, 12 months. What does that look like? What am I, you know, my hard nose, what are my backstops? How can I support myself from, you know, getting into a financial turmoil, All of those sorts of things. It's really, you know, you risk your risk analysis is really just a pros and cons list on steroids. It really just is looking at your cons list and going what if, what if, what if, what if, what if?

32:32And then figuring out whether or not or which ones of those what ifs and non negotiables. That's not OK. That happened now. So what can I do to make sure it doesn't at all because I've got 0 appetite or I could probably do a little bit what's my appetite and how do I keep myself in? What strategies can I put in place to make sure that I don't fall out of that level of risk in that area? And then and go for it. Would you risk it all again? Absolutely, absolutely.

33:01And look, I'm really lucky to have some really great support behind me, which has been really what's made me able to to go for it and grow really quite pleased. I'm sorry, that's all right. So at the moment with your, as you're building your business, are you scaling, are you refining? Are you just happy go lucky? Happy go lucky sounds great. It does, isn't it? It does look, I, I tend to go through these cycles of growth and refine and growth and refine.

33:33And now I would say I'm probably in a bit of a refining moment, but I am excitedly implementing a new system because I love that, because it helps me nerd out. But it's, look, it's, it's really helped streamline. I went through some process mapping of my own and I found a system that can really help me streamline it. I know I practice what I preach. Yeah. So I'm in the process of that at the moment while still working with clients are still, still doing work, still working with, with providers. But yeah, at the moment that's, that's my focus. And then once that is all finalized and in place, then it will be another, another launchpad for my next growth phase.

34:14I know which. Sounds exciting because you've got you've got a bit going on like because you do like educate the community that you've have and you built around you. You got consulting. I have seen you on other podcasts speaking. Is there anything else? Yeah, look, I'd love to do more events this this year. So loving podcasting. I write spilling the quality newsletter on which send out every week, which is all story based, often mildly embarrassing stories about my life that somehow then link back to some sort of insight or or ideas to support quality management in organizations.

34:50So I really, I really enjoy doing that. And yeah, I've got some talks at some networking events coming up as well in WA, which has been exciting. But yeah, look, I'm, I'm just looking forward to, to connecting with more providers and, and to support as many people as I can. So what does your next 12 months look like? Is it more just going to networking and more providers? Yeah, I look, I think a combination of all of those things is what I've got on the cards. But yeah, look, as I said, at the moment my business as usual is as much networking as I can.

35:26So I do a lot of online networking for because I'm based in WA, but I support people across Australia. So I do a lot of online networking to reach people on the eastern coast of this country. And I try to get to as many in person ones in in Perth as well to try and support people. But any more opportunities for for online networking for events and things like that? I'm open for 100%. Yeah. So if I brought you back onto this podcast, say 2 years from now, what would you love to say that you've achieved?

36:00Oh goodness, mate, I really just comes down to supporting the people who who need it. So I'd really, you know, for me it is, I say quality, not quantity, but it is I'm really the I'd really like to be able to support as many providers as possible. So I'd love to launch a talking about policies and procedures before I'd love to launch a policy lab. So an intensive for organizations to be able to join, to be able to support them, to get the confidence and the skills and everything to review and refine their own policies and procedures that they've already got, but that maybe not fit for purpose.

36:42So I'd love to do some some more group things like that that mean that where I can reach more people have. You got any words for anyone that is just using AI with what things to look out for? Because it isn't. It's not the VR and end of it doesn't fix it all your problems as a business. Yep, absolutely. Look, I think AIA 100% has its place and but I think it still comes down to at the moment you get out in a lot of cases what you put in. So you need to have an initial understanding of what it is that you're doing to be able to be able to really create these things that are supportive of your organization. So in some cases, putting into AI, write me a consent policy and using what it spits out is really similar to purchasing one off the shelf.

37:35Unless you know what you need for it to do or what it is that you're wanting for it to achieve for your organization specifically, or what standards you're wanting it to align with and how, yeah, you'll get out what you put in essentially. And you know, I liken it to, you know, if you think about going to have surgery done, would you want to go to a doctor that actually just plugged into AI? How do I cut out someone's tonsils and followed what? So, you know, look, I think there's an element of maintaining your own knowledge, your own confidence that you've built for yourself.

38:09So it's not relying on AI to give you a finished product. It's about utilizing AI to write what you need and know you need faster for you. So I think there's got. To be the element. The AI doesn't have a personality, it's not human, and it still needs a human to read over it and to ensure that what is said is 100% correct. This idea that we can sit and forget and leave the whole project to them is, I think is wrong. Yeah, I'll say it. I do feel like you still need a human element to oversee it. I think it's it's takes away our critical thinking and our creativity or is it risk of taking away our critical thinking and creativity where if we're utilizing it to think for us or to create for us, we're actually losing those skills for ourselves because we don't use them anymore. I guess it's similar to, you know, to, to Googling the answer to everything.

39:04I don't remember. I've never remembered actors names. I'm the person that goes, you know, the guy with the face was in the thing. Yeah. I never forget actors names, but I now can Google the show that I'm watching and see the cast list and then find the face and find who they are and find who I what I saw them in in the past that I recognize them from. So, you know, I've lost. I never really had it. Let's be honest. I never really had the skill to begin with. Yeah, but you know, like I no longer have to sit with that uncomfortable thing of trying to remember and waking up at 3:00 in the morning going.

39:39I've remembered. But I worry, you know, I worry that we, we lose our critical thinking, our own, our innate intelligence because we're outsourcing it to an artificial intelligence. Well, I just feel like it's you can only personality can only do so much. Like I'm, I'm dyslexic as hell so I need chat GPD to run my life so people aren't reading an e-mail and wondering what the hell happened because the structure is completely off. And if I use some interesting words at times so it's you know, So what I think 1 And like for the love of God, I'm never going to know which there to use in a sentence.

40:18It's never going to happen. But I I use it for that stuff, but it can't. It's not created like a human being and it needs to be prompted. Yeah, really. Well, it needs to be prompted really well to replace that. And personally, I don't want my person. I don't want it to get to the point where it's replacing my personality. It hasn't replaced. It does refer to me ChatGPT as brat, but I do find that a little bit funny. That's kind of brilliant. Yep.

40:45That is kind of brilliant. We'll roll with them, but other than that, anybody that's listening, how do they get in contact with you directly? Is it a website? Is it LinkedIn? Absolutely, so you can visit the website qualityhq.com dot AU or please feel free to find me and reach out on LinkedIn. That's where I play after my social media audit. It's pretty much the only place that I play. So find me there and subscribe to spilling the quality. If you're curious about it, jump on. I send one out every Monday.

41:14You can subscribe through the website or through my LinkedIn as well. There's a link on there to subscribe. They're probably the best ways. But yeah, reach out. I'm more than happy to connect and chat. Thank you so much for tonight during the You're so welcome. Until next time you're. Welcome. Thanks for having me, Sarah.