Ep 42: Jane Hanson - Camera Ready, Career Ready: Finding Your Voice and Owning the Room

0:08SPEAKER_00:Stay tuned at the end of this episode for an intimate behind-the-scenes conversation with Jane. Welcome to SheCommerce, where bold brands and fierce women collide in the CPG world. I'm Christina. And I'm Jackie.

0:21SPEAKER_02:And today is another full-on fangirl experience.

0:25SPEAKER_00:Yeah, it absolutely is because there are people that know how to speak well. And then there are people who know how to make you stop and listen when they speak.

0:37SPEAKER_02:And there is the difference. Whether you're presenting to the board, pitching a client, interviewing for your next big role, showing up on camera, or just trying to get a complete sentence out in a meeting without being interrupted.

0:55SPEAKER_00:Oh, we're going there already.

0:57SPEAKER_02:We absolutely are, Ms. Maraniji. Because today is about presence, power, credibility, and how you own a room without turning into some weird, over-rehearsed version of yourself.

1:14SPEAKER_00:That feels very, very relevant right now. I mean, Jackie, how many times have you been on camera just this week alone? Do Teams calls count? Unfortunately, they do.

1:30SPEAKER_02:Then about 195 million. And now there are three versions of every meeting. The actual meeting, the meeting chat, then the other meeting chat, then where everyone is talking about the meeting. Oh, and let's not forget the pre-meeting to the meeting.

1:49SPEAKER_00:Love the pre-meeting. And the underground thing.

1:53SPEAKER_02:Oh, of course. Always with the underground.

1:57SPEAKER_00:But that is the interesting part. We have all these tools to communicate more than ever before. And we have AI that can help us write the script, write the presentation, summarize the meetings, create all of our talking points, clean up the video. Can it make me look eight hours rested? No, unfortunately, that's the killer app we're all still waiting for, as well as the one that can put a full face of makeup on me and make me look ravishing immediately.

2:24SPEAKER_00:But it's still it still can't walk into a room and be you.

2:32SPEAKER_02:Exactly. And maybe the more technology we have, the more valuable the human stuff becomes. Judgment, confidence, empathy, presence, connection.

2:47SPEAKER_00:Especially for women, because I think we've been conditioned to over-prepare the content and then underinvest in the delivery part. We have to know every number, we have all these backup slides, and we've tried to anticipate every question that nobody has even asked yet.

3:06SPEAKER_02:And then somebody says, just be more confident, darling.

3:12SPEAKER_00:Thanks, Chad. Super helpful. What does that even mean? Like, uh can confidence actually even be learned? How do you sound auth authoritative without feeling like you're performing? And how do you hold on to that presence when everything goes completely sideways?

3:34SPEAKER_02:You can't really prep for that. And this is why today's guest is perfection. She learned all of this in one of the most unforgiving environments possible.

3:48SPEAKER_00:Live television.

3:51SPEAKER_02:And now she teaches leaders how to show up with clarity, confidence, and credibility at three C's when the pressure is on.

4:00SPEAKER_00:Yep. We have so much to get into with her. But first, there are women who are making some serious moves. A legendary brand that's asking us to put our phones down. And a hundred million dollar bet that the skills that matter most in AI might actually be the more human ones. Imagine that. You know what time it is. Let's spill some tea. All right, let's spill it. We're starting with our favorite kind of news: women making moves. So first up, we have Ann Halleck, who joined Roku as the senior director of ad marketing.

4:36SPEAKER_00:And recently shared that she joined Roku's ad marketing org. And apparently the welcome wagon has been pretty strong.

4:47SPEAKER_02:Well, hello, of course. It is our favorite person, Anne Halleck. And this caught our our attention because streaming is no longer a content conversation, it's a commerce conversation, it's an advertising conversation. It is a data conversation. And increasingly, it's about how brands connect, all of those things. So Anne, whom we met in Cannes and fell in love with, congratulations! We love seeing women step into influential roles in the places redefining how brands and consumers connect.

5:27SPEAKER_00:Yes. She commerce sisterhood hug from afar. We see you, Anne. We're watching you.

5:36SPEAKER_02:And another one that is very, very close to home. And we're so excited about this. I squealed, not gonna lie. Past She Commerce alumni, Lauren Grusky, has stepped up again at Chase Media Solutions, now being recognized as chief growth officer and managing director.

6:00SPEAKER_00:Can we just say we love a SheCommerce alumni power move so much?

6:11SPEAKER_02:We really, really do. Lauren came on the show and talked openly about career pivots, leadership, and building what's next, and she's doing exactly that. Lauren has been a supporter and friend of SheCommerce right from the get-go. We love you.

6:30SPEAKER_00:Yes. And Chase Media Solutions itself is such an interesting business uh because it represents this bigger expansion of commerce media beyond traditional retailers. Banks have that data, travel companies have data, financial, everyone has data. The definition of who can become a media network just keeps expanding.

6:54SPEAKER_02:Which means the leaders who can connect media, customer value, partnerships, and growth are becoming even more important today. Lauren. Oh, massive congratulations. We are officially claiming at least 2.37% credit.

7:15SPEAKER_00:Yes, totally fabricated but confidently delivered, Jackie. So good job. Very on par for today's theme. All right. This next one I love from a consumer behavior perspective. So Coca-Cola launched a global campaign called The World Will Wait. And essentially, put down the laptop, step away from the screen, and eat with another human being.

7:47SPEAKER_02:A beverage brand is basically staging an intervention for our screen addiction. Love.

7:54SPEAKER_00:Imagine that. We're here for it. The campaign includes films called Laptop Face, uh, the most important meeting, plus AFK meals away from keyboard meals and out of home lines. Like no one ever said this meal could have been an email.

8:13SPEAKER_02:Cute, clever. Which may just be the truest sentence advertising has produced all year.

8:23SPEAKER_00:Likely. But here's the commerce piece I find fascinating. We keep talking about adding technology to experiences, more screens, more personalization, more touch points, more content, all that. Coke is saying that the product can actually represent the absence of all that. We're not selling another digital interaction here. We're selling the moment and experience that you put your phone away and connect with another human.

8:56SPEAKER_02:And that gets back to something that you and I have been saying consistently right from the get-go. The real ROI isn't always about clicks. I'm gonna say it louder for the people at the back. It's about connection. Sometimes the smartest thing a brand can do isn't insert itself into another moment, it's create the reason for the moment to happen.

9:29SPEAKER_00:Exactly. Moving beyond the basket in more ways than more.

9:35SPEAKER_02:And speaking of being human, EY has just put a very large number behind it. One hundred million dollars.

9:50unknown:Yeah.

9:51SPEAKER_00:Yes, EY announced a hundred million dollar investment to re get this, reward US employment for the skills and behaviors it believes matter in this tech-led world, which include business acumen, judgment, critical thinking, adaptability, leadership, collaboration, and innovation.

10:15SPEAKER_02:How perfect is this? Because we have spent the last few years asking, what skills do people need to use on AI? But maybe, just maybe, the better question is what skills become more valuable because AI exists?

10:34SPEAKER_00:Yes, yes, because we know AI can give you the answer, but judgment tells you whether it's the right answer or not. And AI can generate images, the presentation, but you still have to stand up there and make someone else believe, make them care, influence them to act. And AI can give you the words, but it cannot outsource your credibility.

11:03SPEAKER_02:Which is the perfect segue into the fabulous Jane Hansen. There are communication coaches, and then there are people who learn communication with a red light on, breaking new topics, millions of people watching, and absolutely nowhere to hide. Friends, today our guest is none other than the inimitable Jane Hanson. Jane spent decades in one of the toughest proving grounds in media, live New York television. She joined NBC New York in 1979, became co-anchor of Today in New York, later hosted Jane's New York and New York Live, and built a career covering everything from 9-11 and Wall Street to Washington.

11:53SPEAKER_02:Major New York moments and stories around the world. She has interviewed presidents, business leaders, celebrities, prisoners, and newsmakers. She has won not one, not two or three, but nine. That's nine Emmy Awards. Nine.

12:17SPEAKER_00:I mean, nine Emmys. I feel like at some point you just stop finding shelf space and start renovating to them all.

12:26SPEAKER_02:Seriously. Absolutely. But here's what makes Jane especially interesting to us. She took everything she learned while being watched, challenged, and judged in real time, and turned that lens around. Today she's an executive communications coach, helping leaders become stronger on camera in media interviews, presentations, and high-stakes conversations. She has spent more than 30 years helping people communicate with greater clarity, confidence, and presence.

12:57SPEAKER_02:And in an era where AI can manufacture almost anything, we are talking to someone whose career has been built around the one thing you cannot fake for very long. Human credibility.

13:21SPEAKER_01:Well, thank you. I'm excited to be here because I love you guys, even though I've only known you for a short period of time. But that was way too long, an intro. I mean, come on. Oh my gosh. We've been going on in all the things, Jane.

13:35SPEAKER_00:Yeah, there's so much we already have in a celebration. It's been a wonderful look. Yeah, exactly. We're gonna talk about all of it.

13:44SPEAKER_01:So much for having me. I truly appreciate that.

13:47SPEAKER_00:Of course. And we have we have to mention how we met Jane. So it was at Cannes this summer in at the end of June. And um one morning, we all decided to maybe take the value route, I'll say, and stay off site or maybe last minute. That's availability, that's for late planners. Um and we stayed at a place that was, let's just say, not the four, not the four-star quality, four-star quality that we had hoped. Um, we were lucky to even get a clean towel during our stay there.

14:20SPEAKER_00:And one morning we uh It was the base motel, Christine.

14:25SPEAKER_02:Yes, let's just call it the base motel.

14:28SPEAKER_00:It was a base motel. And we we bonded over that. We met in the shuttle that we commandeered from uh uh other individuals in a company paying for that shuttle to get over there because Ubers were definitely lacking. So we are shuttle buddies till the end.

14:44SPEAKER_01:That and then of course we had a lot of fun talking about the pink toilet paper.

14:47SPEAKER_00:Oh my god, yes, yes, which they should bring in the marketplace.

14:56SPEAKER_01:Yeah, they're all up somewhere, somewhere they're good. But um, you know, the thing that was so much fun about that is that it was a chance encounter, and we literally needed a ride, and we weren't getting that anybody, everybody was just coping and helping each other, and which I think is a great statement about today's world and women in business, because I remember when the when everybody was competing so much for very few jobs, and you just felt this sense of I have to be better than her, I have to be better than her.

15:29SPEAKER_01:Today it's how can I help you? And it shows what a long way we've come. And that's what I saw in the two of you when we were in Cannes, which isn't a bad place to be, although it was awfully hot. Uh, but despite despite all of that, we managed to, you know, get work done, have a great time, meet lots of people, and enjoy the heck off of it.

15:49SPEAKER_02:You know, there's there's space for everyone. That's that's what we believe, Jane. There's space for everyone. And I mean, let's let's be honest, the rose helped a lot. That's true. Absolutely.

16:03SPEAKER_01:Yeah, yeah. Yep, exactly.

16:06SPEAKER_02:All right. Now we're gonna get started with taking us a little way back, where you spent decades as one of New York's most recognizable anchors. You were sitting in a seat where people weren't just hearing you, they were watching everything. What did those early years behind the anchor desk teach you about power and pressure of being watched?

16:31SPEAKER_01:Well, it's it just continued throughout all of it. But the but the big thing is that yes, you're being watched, and yes, people are making a lot of judgments about you, which got very, you know, at times that would be a little bit frightening. But I believe overall, I I'd loved it when I'd walk into a room to interview somehow, some big powerful male executive. And the moment you turned the camera on, they all got a little freaked out. So I felt very powerful in that moment.

16:57SPEAKER_01:And I knew that I might be able to get them to say almost anything I wanted because they they were fearful. And that's something that people need to overcome. But I don't think you ever get over this thing about everybody knowing who you are and what you do. It helped me because of the perks were amazing. I mean, I got into any new restaurant, got tickets for events for anything. I could talk, people would pick up when I pick up the phone and call someone and and they say my name, they go, Oh, yeah, of course I'll talk to you.

17:27SPEAKER_01:So that was pretty cool. But um one of my one of my favorite stories is when I was doing the show of my own called Jane's New York, you know, we did it in a very casual way. And I always wore a leather jacket and jeans, and you know, we have beautiful lighting and et cetera, et cetera. Um, I got an email one day from this woman who said, I don't think you dress appropriately. I don't think you're being a good role model. And I think maybe you're too old to dress that way.

17:51SPEAKER_01:No, I wasn't that old, but anyway, so that's what she said. And, you know, usually I would ignore that sort of thing. But I had a boss a long time ago who said, talk to the viewers. So I wrote her back and I said, Can you give me more on what you mean by this? What how do you think I should dress? Tell me what you would like to see me and tell you, tell me how you think I would be more professional. And she wrote back and she said, I'm really embarrassed that I sent that email.

18:17SPEAKER_01:Because it just so happens that I was watching a show and it used to air on a Saturday night around seven o'clock, and then also on Sunday mornings. She said, I'm watching a show. And my husband walks in the room and he goes, Why can't you dress like her? She's hot. And apparently, she said, it set me off so much, and I got really angry. And so I wrote that, and I'm sorry, and I really didn't mean it because you should just keep dressing just like you are.

18:40SPEAKER_01:You look wonderful, clearly in the eyes of my husband, too. So what I learned from that was a lot of the time when people give you criticism or they say mean things to you, and I used to get things about why did you wear that dress? Or I don't like your hair, you cut your hair, or I had one person once that said I was playing with my ring too much. I mean, it's just like ridiculous. But you have to understand that they're insecure.

19:04unknown:Yeah.

19:04SPEAKER_01:And so therefore, if you if you acknowledge their own insecure their insecurity, you can then understand that maybe there's some legitimacy to what they're saying, but maybe there's not. So think about dealing with people, very judgmental people in that way. And I think it'll help us all get a lot, get along a lot better.

19:24SPEAKER_02:I love that. It's a great perspective. I absolutely love that. And and and that means that, I mean, even though you've had that scrutiny your entire life, you know, behind the anchor, um, you it sounds like you've kind of got used to it. And you this was your coping mechanism of I say coping mechanism, this was how you dealt with it.

19:47SPEAKER_01:Yeah, it is. But also, I mean, you know, people could be hurtful, but you had to have very thick skin because they were constantly, there was, it was constantly something. And by the way, there's also something cool about people being that in interested and invested in you. I mean, I worked with somebody last week, and um, the guy said to me uh that he wrote his mom and he was telling us all about this executive coaching I did, and he was very grateful for it because it was, I thought it was extraordinarily useful for his life.

20:18SPEAKER_01:And his mom says, and he remembered me from TV, and then his mom said, Oh my God, I love her. She, I just loved her so much, you have to tell her that. So you have these abilities to connect to people that become really important. And there is it. And I get a lot out of it because it means I'm serving a role. And I love that I'm having an impact.

20:41SPEAKER_00:It's such an impact. I mean, you we said it, you won nine Emmys over the course of your career, but we know that awards only or usually capture the end result, but not all the work, right? Sweat, tears, all that that took you to get there. So was there a moment earlier in your career when you realized that preparation and presence mattered just as much as, you know, the words on the page?

21:11SPEAKER_01:Well, that was pretty evident early on because the camera doesn't lie. It also depletes us of a lot, about 30% of our energy. And it's it's it's hard to how to explain this, but you're being in one dimension versus three dimension. And so it it kind of changes up and skews a lot of things. And by the way, we're in our own little television studio right now, even though we don't have all the state of the art cameras that we had at NBC, but you know, it is it is what it is.

21:45SPEAKER_01:But um so but I was really well known for all of the live stuff I did, being in the field or the breaking news. I mean, I was the one who was actually always wanting to do that stuff, and believe it or not, a lot of news people don't like. Doing it. They're unsure of being in the live situation about what they might say and how they can handle it. And I've just witnessed that a lot. For example, I was the first person on the air at NBC on 9-11. And I went on the air with somebody, but the producer saying to me in my ear, a plane just hit the World Trade Center.

22:19SPEAKER_01:Get on, we're going on the air, start talking. I have no information, only have pictures that came from the camera we had on top of the Empire State Building. So I start to talk and I say, We, this is what we know. We know that a plane has hit the World Trade Center. We know that there's smoke billowing out. Take a look at the picture. This is what we can see. But we don't have any other information. I have nowhere to go, and I had to kind of just dance around it.

22:43SPEAKER_01:And they finally get this guy on the air with me who's a janitor from West 12th Street. His name was Anthony. And Anthony says, Now this belies everything we thought at that point. We didn't think it was a terrorist attack. We thought it was a plane that somehow had gone amiss. Guy said, it was it was a big plane. It was blue and silver in it in it and it seemed to rev up the engine as it got closer to the building, and then it just hit and it exploded.

23:07SPEAKER_01:And you have to pray for them because they're all dead. Now, this is about two and a half minutes into me being on the air. And I said, I'm going, oh my lord, what do I do with this? And I said to the guy, I said, we can't speculate like that. We don't know anything. Just take me step by step what you saw. Because I knew that his eyewitness account could give us some really, really true information about what was going on. It wasn't until about how long ago?

23:36SPEAKER_01:Was it half an hour when the second plane hit that we really knew what it was?

23:40unknown:Yeah.

23:41SPEAKER_01:So anyway, I guess what I'm saying is all of this stuff becomes, I was all about the live stuff for me. And in the live, you don't really have a script. And you're in the moment and you have to be adaptable and flexible. It's the same thing when you're doing interviews. And so in my work today, the people that I'm working with, it's it's about them being live in presentations. And if they're doing interviews in that moment, how do you deal with that moment?

24:10SPEAKER_01:So I think that's what's really crucial.

24:13SPEAKER_02:How do you do that, Jane? I mean, how do you you pivot on a dime? How do you gracefully swerve and deal with that complete and utter unknown?

24:27unknown:Yeah.

24:28SPEAKER_01:Well, there's a couple of ways. One of one of them is you use the word pivot. Um, I like to use it called bridging, which is acknowledge, transition, and back to your message. Because you're you're ultimately, and you guys get this all the time, you're ultimately going to be given a question, asked a question, or there'll be something that'll come out of nowhere that you don't expect, and you have to find a way to get back to what it is that you want to say.

24:56SPEAKER_01:And time is finite, especially in like in the world of broadcasting. In the world of podcasting, not so finite, but it's still there's a finite amount of time that people are going to listen to something or watch something. So um, so the pivoting part becomes I have to be really clear about knowing what I want to say and what I want people to walk away from this moment with. And I have to deflect questions that are going to take me off what I want to say and take me to a place uh where I'm able to continue getting my message out there.

25:31SPEAKER_01:Because you're usually there for one main reason, which is to to impart some information that's really valuable. Um, and that I think we have to figure, you know, we have to figure out how to do that. And people have a tough time because I mean, I know one of the questions we were going to talk about was me, how did I um make this pivot from what I do now from television to what I do now? And I think this relates to this. My aha moment was I was in the studio and I'm interviewing this author, and I don't, to this day, I don't remember who it was.

26:04SPEAKER_01:But he started to give me some information in the first question that I found far more interesting than his book. So I kept asking him questions about that. And as a result, he never really talked about the book. Now, what was his point of being there? He's trying to sell the book. So we walk out of the studio and he goes, I I I never got to say what I came to say. And I looked at him and I said, Well, whose fault was that? And he goes, Oh. So I realized in that moment that I know how to help people answer questions and and and choreograph an interview or choreograph a presentation.

26:41SPEAKER_01:To me, it was really easy, but to a lot of people, it's really hard. And they forget that you have to have this super clear message because people aren't going to remember everything you said. But I love the Maya Angela quote. People will forget what you did, they'll forget what you said, but they'll never forget how you made them feel. Yes. Sounds a good thought. That is so very true.

27:06SPEAKER_00:Well, I mean, and you've interviewed such a range of people, right? From presidents, business leaders, uh, celebrities, and every everyone in between. Um, and even everyday people that are like you talked about 9-11 that are experiencing those uh extraordinary circumstances. So when someone has sat across from you, Jane, could you tell? Do you have this like innate power? I feel like you do, to tell almost immediately whether they're going to command the conversation and have that presence and then use that to you know help coach them.

27:45SPEAKER_01:Oh, yeah. I mean, when I'm coaching them, um, most of the time I'm coaching people for a reason, which is they've got something special coming up, or their bosses have felt that they needed the coaching, or a CEO is on the hot seat, or something is happening. Sometimes it's crisis communications because something awful has happened. But I can tell just by the way they hold themselves, by their body language, by the way that they speak, everything gives you signals about who and what they are.

28:13SPEAKER_01:And so for me, I am I immediately assess. I do a lot of prep work before I work with people, but I do a lot of prep work that will tell me what I see that they need and how they're going to reach their goals. Um and I have them self-assess themselves too. But what I but what I see when somebody is really with it, I'll tell you, the nicest people were some of the ones that I interviewed were some of the ones who were at the very top of the of the ladder.

28:41SPEAKER_01:Why? Probably for the same reasons they got there. They were smart, they knew how to really listen, they respected people, they the and and and they had unbelievable kind of empathy. And those were the people that when you met them, that's when you knew that they were the real deal. But it kind of sometimes it'd be the lesser people that just the lesser titled people, I guess I should say, that would not be as able to do a great interview or have a great coaching session because they just don't get it.

29:18SPEAKER_02:Yeah. That's interesting. And actually, that is not dissimilar to a number of experiences I've had. The further up the chain you go, uh weirdly, the nicer and more genuine and more supportive they tend to be. Right? Great.

29:37SPEAKER_01:Yeah, I absolutely agree with that.

29:39SPEAKER_02:I Jane, I want to tackle confidence, the the whole uh the the confidence issue, because women, not Christina and I, you know, but women, a lot of women, hear this constantly. You know, you just need to be more confident. As though confidence is, you know, in aisle five that you can just get on your you know weekly shop. So so is confidence, oh tell us, Jane, is confidence something that people either have or not, or can it genuinely be trained?

30:12SPEAKER_01:It could absolutely be trained. We become more confident because of our experiences. And as we go through life, that's they they really help add to our repertoire what we're capable of doing. And the more, the more you do, the better you feel, the better you feel, the more confident you are. It all just builds upon itself. One of the things with women that I see, because I work with a lot of them, uh they people come at us from so many different ways.

30:43SPEAKER_01:And what I see is that women don't necessarily value themselves as what as they should. So, what I would suggest is women write down, sit and really think about this. Write down your core competencies. What are you really good at? And then pin it up someplace and look at it every day for a while, because it will help you understand just how capable you are. And most of the time, when you're in a position of where you're going to speak, you're there for a reason.

31:15SPEAKER_01:You're the expert at that moment in whatever subject it is you're talking about. You're not there because you're some fluke that's somebody said, Oh, just go talk to them. You're there because you have an important reason to be there. So own it. Believe in it, believe in yourself. We we just we we do ourselves an injustice constantly. And it's so funny because time after time I'll be working with people, and I usually video as a big part of my work.

31:39SPEAKER_01:And when I video people, well, they'll put up on the screen, inevitably women say, Oh, I hate my hair. Oh, my voice is squeaky. And they'll say all these things that put themselves down. We just we're so mean to each to our ourselves, not to each other, but to ourselves.

31:56SPEAKER_00:We are our biggest critics for sure. And staring back at yourself all day on a Teams meeting definitely doesn't help, but I get I totally heard you're saying. And let's let's make this really practical too for our listeners. Uh, a job interview today is essentially a media appearance. You have the setting window, you're being evaluated, all eyes on you. Often it's it's a virtual call such as this, where you're on video. Um, the content matters, obviously, what you're saying and your your intelligence and how that comes across, but so does everything around you.

32:33SPEAKER_00:So, do you have any tips for absolutely nailing an interview? Whether that's virtual or in person? Uh yes, I do.

32:45SPEAKER_01:Yeah. Well, there's a big difference between the two of them because body language is is is important in both of them, but it's a different type of body language because we're only seeing this much of us, you know, in in this moment. So it's all about our facial expressions. And and even though I'm not suggesting you use your hands up here like this, because somebody's just gonna go, what the hell is she doing with her hands? So what we want to I I use mine down below the screen because they add a lot of emphasis to our words.

33:13SPEAKER_01:So we think about that. Think about really good eye contact, because if we can't, if you don't have good eye contact, you're not connecting with the other human being. And really understand your posture. How are you sitting? So that's that's just the the visual side in in what we're in in a job interview or an interview as such, whatever it is. Then there's what are you saying? I mean, there's three peak peak parts of communication. Well, um, who are you talking to?

33:41SPEAKER_01:What are you saying, and how are you saying it? And they're all equally important, although the body language part becomes more important because you know it's it's the delivery that really counts. Two people can say the same thing and it'll sound entirely different. Um so in an interview, you want to have good content prepare and anticipate what many of the questions will be, but also anticipate that you're going to get questions that you are not expecting.

34:06SPEAKER_01:It's part of their, you know, their tricks. So learn the culture of whatever company it is. Really, you know, understand that you need to know as much as you can about that company to see if you're a good fit. Uh, and that's that's in if you're in real, you know, in real life or in a job, I mean on virtual. In real life, your body language becomes your whole body. And did you know that people make an instant judgment about you within one tenth of a second of you opening a door, walking in a room?

34:40SPEAKER_01:Yes, it doesn't solidify until about seven seconds in, and it will take eight more encounters with that same person before they'll they'll revise their instant first impression of you.

34:52SPEAKER_00:Wow.

34:53SPEAKER_01:Oh my god. So think about I mean you could, and there's things so simple as how do they dress when they go to work at this company? How am I supposed to dress when I'm representing uh my company in a in a in a in a media interview? How am I, you know, how do I do you these these are all little subtle things that make a huge difference.

35:13SPEAKER_02:And Jane, does that you know that that that impression in the first one-tenth of a second? Does that come with you know all the preconceived notions and pre-existing biases and and all of that that you might have, whether conscious or unconscious?

35:29SPEAKER_01:Yes, it certainly does. And I mean, just test yourself. Do this do the there's a there's a little trick I sometimes do. I'll sit in a bench in a street in Manhattan and I watch the people going by and I make up stories about each one of them based upon how they look, their facial expressions, their pace, all this stuff. And and then you will you will find out how just how biased you might be. Oh, people slump, that means that they're probably not very energetic.

35:59SPEAKER_01:I don't want to work with them. Or yeah. And think about it, we all do it. It's just inborn, it's innate in us. So we have to we have to really kind of self-monitor about am I being fair? Because frequently we're not yeah, no, it's a good point.

36:17SPEAKER_00:You have to catch yourself and I think acknowledging those things that we know we do it ourselves, and you know, we we obviously can try to control that as best as possible, but like understanding that it's not it's only human. People are gonna do that to us too. So we need to, to your point, try to manage that as best as possible.

36:40SPEAKER_01:Right. Exactly. So give you do yourself a favor and and really think about all of what I've mentioned before you go into that interview, whatever it is, be it a media interview, a job interview, etc., because it will help you get what you want. And you may also decide, I don't want this based upon their answers to your questions. It's a two-way street here. That's the other thing. We forget about that. You're you're choosing as much as they are. Exactly.

37:13SPEAKER_02:So let's that's now. Um I've I've I used to do that a lot. I used to make these epic sagas in my head of, you know, the whole history of where these people were, where they came from, where they're going. Uh more flights of fancy, you know, when I was bored or or waiting for someone. Um I'm gonna check that the next time. I'm gonna check what, you know, why I've made the stories that I've made. Um because I never thought of it that way. I just thought I was being a complete imagination dwork.

37:46SPEAKER_01:Right. But we do are.

37:49SPEAKER_02:I mean, yeah, sports. Wow. Thanks. I'm taking that as a compliment, Christina, whether you meant it that way or not. Um Jane.

38:03SPEAKER_01:She did, of course she did.

38:08SPEAKER_02:Have you met Christina Jane? Yeah, I know. So, Jane, we've talked about, we we kind of touched about AI um when we were chatting in Ken. And we're, you know, we're entering this world of AI-generated video and clone voices, avatars, and increasingly polished synthetic content. I mean, just today, Claude dropped something, uh, Claude dropped a uh an ability to create instant videos um that can switch different backgrounds in the blink of an eye. So you I'd love your gut reaction.

38:46SPEAKER_02:You know, does authentic human presence become more valuable as artificial communication gets better? Or does the audience eventually stop caring?

39:00SPEAKER_01:I don't think they stop caring at all. And in fact, what we're going through right now with AI is being called the fourth industrial revolution. And the projections are that communication has become probably one of the most important skills that one could have. Why? Because good communication means that you are a master at relationships. And what exists when you get into this world of AI? Talking to other people, creating relationships, having all of that.

39:30SPEAKER_01:So my personal opinion is that communication is just never more important than it is in today's world. People are not stupid. They see, um you know, one of my I love looking at this, the stupid, uh, I think it's on Instagram, the stupid thing about how you can put a picture in and then they'll make you dance. Yeah.

39:50SPEAKER_03:Uh-huh.

39:51SPEAKER_01:Oh, yeah. And you see these couples. It's the most hilarious thing because you know damn well that they can't dance like that at all. And it's just, it's looking at it going, am I gonna believe that any of this is real? So it's just we we we know now. And people become very good at understanding when you send them something that that you might have allegedly written that it's not your words. Yeah, or it's AI generated.

40:21SPEAKER_00:So there's a lot of tells there.

40:24SPEAKER_01:I just I I just exactly and I I think that the in the I I really truly believe that we need to focus on how are we how are we you know interacting with with people everywhere because we just have to get better at it. And I feel really sorry for I just go on. Sorry. No, finish your thought, please. Oh, I was just saying, I feel sorry for for a generation of kids that were that were in really crucial stages of the of growing up during COVID when they couldn't go to school and the only way they communicated was through all of this.

41:10SPEAKER_01:Um they didn't learn a lot of the social processes.

41:13SPEAKER_03:Yeah.

41:13SPEAKER_01:And these they're now they're now graduating from college and trying to get jobs, and they're having a really hard time, and they're struggling because they can't they can't communicate well.

41:24SPEAKER_02:Correct.

41:25unknown:Right.

41:25SPEAKER_02:It's it's it's I mean, it's not just the COVID kids, though. It's it's it's a generation. It's a generation of people who just, you know, spent their entire time communicating via screen.

41:38SPEAKER_00:Yeah. And I think there's a little bit of tension here, you know, because we we want people to be authentic, but there's also that part where you're on stage, you're in an interview, you're presenting to leadership, and you're you're also needing to be strategic, right? So where does preparation end and that performance factor begin? And you know, is it possible for someone to be too polished? And then they they come across as you know, unauth inauthentic and not genuine.

42:14SPEAKER_01:Well, I'll tell you what I see is a lot of women believe that when they're given a role to play that's on a stage of some sort, they all of a sudden become formal Jane or formal Jackie or formal Christina and think that they have to act like there's some just different. And their voice changes, their posture changes, everything changes, and you know that they're just full of it because it's not real. And it's because they're afraid of showing who they are.

42:47SPEAKER_01:You know, um, Brene Brown, I know you guys have probably heard of Brene Brown. I love her. So she talks about something called the vulnerability paradox, which is vulnerability is the first thing we look for in others and the last thing we want people to see in us. But the really weird part about that is the more vulnerable we are in front of people, the more we connect with them because we're being truly human. And that's what happens when you allow yourself to be authentic.

43:18SPEAKER_01:We're afraid of it because we don't people we don't want people to see the real us, but when they see the real us, that's when they connect more with us.

43:27SPEAKER_02:So we don't we don't want the people to see the chinks in our armor though, Jane. I think that's exactly because that's how we've been conditioned.

43:36SPEAKER_01:Right, exactly. Yeah. So just so let them see the chinks and and and and just be you because that's what works. Yeah. I I didn't get the memo about being formal. Well, it takes a while to get there. Again, it's something else that I can't think comes with experience because you learn, you take a Chance in something and that works, and then you take a little bigger chance in something else. Like, for example, women sometimes don't like to say their say their piece in a meeting, they don't raise their hand and say, Oh, well, I have a great idea.

44:11SPEAKER_01:They just kind of hold it back. Or sometimes when they make the suggestion, nobody says, Yeah, that's a good idea. They just kind of ignore it. And three minutes or five minutes later, somebody says the same thing. Yeah. And and that you're going, Well, what wait, wait, I I said that. So take the chance. What's the worst thing that could happen? People will appreciate you.

44:35SPEAKER_00:Yeah. You know, one thing we have to get into is that you've already started going there, that the different expectations for women. You know, women get some very confusing advice around how to communicate to be confident, but don't be too confident because that's intimidating. Or be assertive, but don't be aggressive, be warm, but make sure you're still taken seriously. It's like, oh my gosh, where do I go with that? So speak up, but apparently not too much, because then you're being, you know, overly aggressive.

45:06SPEAKER_00:You're taking over, et cetera. So, you know, after decades of watching and coaching women, how do you help women navigate a standard that sometimes feels conflicting and impossible?

45:22SPEAKER_01:I just go back to being allowing yourself to be vulnerable and be real. The and and to think about, yes, we are compared constantly to men, but one of the things that I mean, this sounds almost like really one of the things I notice is that women are almost afraid to express themselves in the way they look and the way they dress. I think we're getting better at it, but we we have the advantage because we can wear almost anything and any color. So why do you wear black?

45:58SPEAKER_01:Because it hides you, it makes you invisible. Why do you wear the color black? It makes almost every woman's face look um tired and it drains us of energy. So we put ourselves in positions where where we don't need to be. Add some color to your life and it'll make yourself free you up. Uh so just think about we don't have to wear a uniform and allow yourself to just be free. Now, you're probably thinking, well, that doesn't really answer my question, but we do have a lot of mixed signals, so I think we have to ignore them.

46:40SPEAKER_01:If you are being real, you're not you're not going to be aggressive because you're being intense or because you're being strong or assertive. If you are being real, then you're not going to be the person who's um being a word that rhymes with ditch. I can say bitch on this show, can't I? Of course I can. Totally. You can say bitch. Okay, go for it. I would say I already did. Um the it's it's just such an interesting paradox to me, because the more we have that we make all of life a real conversation, the less we will be accused of being all of those things.

47:25SPEAKER_01:And we have to feel free enough to be able to do that. Okay.

47:30SPEAKER_02:I I I want to address, address that, that point though, Jane. Um because A, I love it. However, B, what about women who, you know, you you may have coached who who thought that they had a communication problem, and then you know, they they were themselves, they were free, but actually, she was in a room that was judging her by a completely different standard. How did how how does that work?

48:02SPEAKER_01:Well, first of all, you have to figure out what that standard is. Yeah. And every, you know, all businesses, for example, have different kinds of cultures. But we've become much more casual. So some of the most in some of them some of the the most conservative of businesses are now are now a lot freer in that sense. And they've and when there's so many women in the in the in the workplace now that that can help each other out. So you can talk about together kind of the standards.

48:32SPEAKER_01:What are the standards? Watch out for this guy, or watch out for you know, this kind of board meeting, or watch out for doing this, or whatever it is. So we can help each other out too by by talking about this stuff. I think that helps. Um the the rules may be different, but they're not as far apart as they used to be. And I think that's what's important to understand.

48:59SPEAKER_00:That's boring. Um, is there one piece of public speaking or leadership advice that we society routinely gives young women that you would love to retire forever, ban it?

49:18SPEAKER_01:Um I'm sure there's much of it. Keep going.

49:24SPEAKER_02:That that was no, that that was the that was the question. That was the question. Oh, that was the question.

49:29SPEAKER_01:Um well it would be it would be not try not to put on the false front of being too formal and thinking that that's what you have to be. And don't be afraid. Don't do not have fear because when you have fear, that just it it just gets in the way of everything else. And it gets in the way of you being good at what you do and of you showing off your best stuff. Fear is not good. And and if you you're you're fearful in your whatever your workplace is, then you got trouble.

50:05SPEAKER_02:Yeah.

50:06SPEAKER_01:Um, and again, getting back to what I said before about be yourself, all of life is just a conversation. Why can't you have that same conversation in the workplace that you can have at home or with your best friends? Because it if we take that stance that everything we do is just a conversation, it suddenly releases releases a lot of the pressure and it makes you become better.

50:33SPEAKER_02:But Jane, at home or in our family, if we don't like Uncle Bob, we don't have to speak to him. If Uncle Bob's mean, we don't have to talk to Uncle Bob, right? But if but we we can't exactly not talk to our colleagues because they are toxic or you know narcissistic. So it's kind of I guess kind of figuring out how we make the best of that situation because Uncle Bob is banned from the house, but you know, a good question.

51:13SPEAKER_00:But work bob is on unfortunately.

51:16SPEAKER_01:But work bob is right there, front and center. Gotta deal with work bob every day. One of the things that I have turned bad situations into good situations by simply asking the right questions and listening. This is where you need to be a good listener. Being a good listener means that you really understand where someone is coming from. So with somebody like that, they're obviously, they've probably got they got a problem. We don't know what it is, but there is something that's getting into their head every single day when they walk into the office or get on the screen.

51:55SPEAKER_01:So, how do we how do we deal with them in an effective way? It's just like what I did with that woman that told me about my my clothing. Once you actually say to them, tell me more, what is it that is going on here? And you might not be able to have that candid of a conversation with Workplace Bob, but what you can do is on a regular basis, ask them questions, listen to what they're saying, and that they will give you clues about how you can deal with them better.

52:27SPEAKER_01:Sometimes it doesn't work, but it's the way that it's been very effective for me by having real conversations with people about how we can have a better relationship. Or sometimes you got to find something you can like about Workplace Bob. Like maybe, maybe he's the one that's doing all the, you know, all the heavy lifting of um, I don't know, paperwork or something. And he won't be around for long because AL replaced him, but um anyway, which is so that's what you like about him.

53:01SPEAKER_01:Um you can say, I like how you I like how you did X, Y, or Z. And they'll be the moment that you start to compliment people, they're kind of whoa, and you could find something nice about everybody if you really try. And if you have to work with this person every day, try to think about how I what can I find that's good about them? And you might be able to get along.

53:34SPEAKER_02:I like that. So actually taking that, Jane, um, one of my bugbears is how people talk about how communication is just such a great soft skill to have, which is which is ridiculous. Utterly ridiculous because you can have the best idea and the strategy, um, or have the most amazing business acumen in the world. But if you can't convince someone to invest by, join, believe in it, you have a problem. So it's not a soft skill. It is hard as heck. Um, so why should founders and senior leaders treat communication training as pivotal, as seriously as financial planning, sales strategy, or marketing?

54:25SPEAKER_01:Well, first of all, I believe that it's a hard skill in today's world. Yes, definitely. And if you take a look at what most leaders do, and I'm gonna tell you right now that just about every CEO that I know of does some sort of communications training. It can be expensive and it involves, you know, a lot uh it it really involves a commitment and a commitment to your team to do it. Why should they do it though? Because it can prevent a lot of stupid things from happening.

54:59SPEAKER_01:What I mean by that is if you teach your people how to work together as a team, I work with a lot of teams too, by the way. When when you teach them to work together as a team, that collaboration is going to make your business better. You're going to sell more product, you're going to have more opportunities to tell your story. You're going to have all these great things to be able to do because your team and your people all communicate better. I work with people from every industry in the world.

55:28SPEAKER_01:And they these these skills are completely, they go across it all. And the other thing that happens is you could you could also let you know you can prevent things from happening like something going viral because there's been some problem with something. There's some, and then good communication prevents those things. So we just have to we just have to figure out how do we get people to do more of this and to think about it, just at least think about it.

55:57SPEAKER_01:It's yeah. And especially in this world of social media where things go off the charts critically very quickly, to have a good communication ability will prevent you from losing jobs or having your reputation smeared or whatever it is. It really, and it's all about how you how you deal with the problem. And you don't know how to deal with it if you don't know how to communicate.

56:26SPEAKER_00:Imagine a world where people actually thought before they spoke or thought before they posted or hit the send button on that email, etc. It's a good reminder. Check yourself. Yeah. Well, J.

56:44SPEAKER_03:Absolutely.

56:46SPEAKER_00:Yeah, for sure. I I wanna maybe jump to what's next for you. You know, you've already lived a life that, yeah, you've lived a life that people can only imagine, right? You had this remarkable first act in journalism and equally fascinating now, second act and helping people and coaching them and helping them find their voice. So what do you hope someone you've coached carries with them long, long after they've forgotten about the individual tips you may have given them?

57:16SPEAKER_00:And like, what's next on your bingo card?

57:22SPEAKER_01:Uh, I'm in the process of writing a book, which I've been in the process of doing for quite some time. And I made the mistake of of showing some of the asking too many people their opinions, which you should never do. And then they all said, Oh, I think you should change this and you should add this and you should do this. And I just put the book away, but I'm just brought it back out now. My goal was to do a lot of work on it in August, and today is not August.

57:44SPEAKER_01:So but I will I will get to it because it's a lot of fun and I always love writing, and I think that'll be fun. Um, I also I'm doing a lot more work with different kinds of outlets and and places. I don't know how to describe it. I really want to help younger people, which is it's kind of a hard crowd to get into because they they don't know what they need and they don't necessarily want to make a commitment to this kind of training. But I really want to help them learn how to be more effective.

58:22SPEAKER_01:And I think by enhancing their communication skills, that will work. So that's something else that I I really want to do. I love doing you know what they call fireside interviews at conferences and and events. I mean, that's so much fun, even though there's never a fire. Um but I never understood those. I know. I think they were named after like somebody's fireside chats that they used to have next to a real fire. And it's like it's like the green room in TV, the the waiting room.

58:52SPEAKER_01:It's never green. No, I'm not green.

58:54SPEAKER_03:It's insane.

58:55SPEAKER_01:You just became a name. So so I think that's what's what's next for me. Uh the the the it's always a I do everything. And you and you know, the best part is that you get to do all these things because you keep connecting with people. And how do you connect with people just like we we connected? You just start talking.

59:15SPEAKER_02:Absolutely.

59:16SPEAKER_01:And everybody's got a story.

59:18SPEAKER_00:And the one thing that I've that I wanted to we don't have a problem with that. The one thing I wish that's right.

59:23unknown:Yeah.

59:25SPEAKER_02:Oh, no. God, getting us to stop is the problem.

59:28SPEAKER_01:Yeah, exactly. That's exactly right. Um and by the way, that is a great reporter's trick. You ask somebody a question, they answer it, and then you sit in silence. And guess what happens? They can't stand the dead air, and they're afraid they didn't answer it correctly. And that's what people most of the time say something they didn't want to say. So there. I also I the one other thing that I want to talk about for one second is telling great stories because what that is really, really important in any kind of a presentation and in an interview.

1:00:07SPEAKER_01:The more stories you can tell, the better it's going to be because people remember stories 22 times more often, they're 22 times more memorable than data. So use a story and tell your own story well. It's very important that we all know our own story. It changes, we can change, continue to revise it and change it and fix it, but tell it well and have fun with it. So, storytelling has been around since the beginning of mankind, and we still today don't tell enough stories.

1:00:45SPEAKER_01:And people are afraid to tell their story. So I would encourage them to really get their narrative down and get it out there and be honest, as honest as you want to be. Make it make it interesting, make it engaging, and you know, have fun. I keep saying that, but it's really about having fun too when you're telling your own story, because nobody else can tell it like you can. Oh, absolutely.

1:01:10SPEAKER_02:You know, Jane, that is so true because I you know, I I I remember from when I was a kid, my grandpa, my grandpa was a master storyteller, which then ha w handed out to my dad, and they would captivate the entire family when they'd sit down and they'd and it would be storytime at night, right? And it it was apparently for allegedly for the kids, but you'd have all the uh all the um uh older people, you know, the uncles and the aunts and the and and and uh mom and dad, they would sit and they would listen to grandpa weave this beautiful tale of either 1001 nights or you know, Indian mythology or or or something that he'd made up on the spur of the moment.

1:01:57SPEAKER_02:It was it was beautiful, and and I carried that all the way through, you know, with when my father did it as well. And I do that with my kids. We make up stories as we go through, and and then and you know, especially on long car journeys, and they they're like, oh, and then what happened next? And in my heart, and I'm like, Yes, I did it.

1:02:21SPEAKER_01:I love that. I mean, stories are us and they just work. Just sometimes don't make them too long. Yeah. How do we start that story?

1:02:37SPEAKER_00:Well, Jane, you've interviewed everybody else. So now we want to put you on the record in our signature round here. That sounds that sounds bad.

1:02:49SPEAKER_02:Fast answers, minimal meaning training.

1:02:52SPEAKER_00:Fast answers. Okay, what are the questions? All right, ready? First, best communication lesson you've ever learned from a woman.

1:03:04SPEAKER_01:I think from my mother, who said, don't talk as much, listen more. You have two ears and one mouth for a reason.

1:03:14SPEAKER_02:Man, how many times did I get that from my mom?

1:03:17SPEAKER_00:I swear. I know, I feel like I've heard that too.

1:03:23SPEAKER_02:Worst on-camera advice you've ever received. Uh don't cry.

1:03:31SPEAKER_01:Which, yeah. Now, let me tell you why I don't think I think it's bad advice. You don't want a weeping anchor, but um when when the moment is appropriate and something is really, don't be afraid to allow those emotions to come through because you're a human being.

1:03:49SPEAKER_02:Of course.

1:03:50SPEAKER_01:And sometimes, you know, you feel like, oh, I have to be so perfect. Well, nobody's perfect. And if you don't share with the empathy, then you know, just think of Dolly.

1:04:06SPEAKER_02:Always. I I I have a a football, uh a cowboy boot.

1:04:12SPEAKER_00:Oh, that's so cute. Um all right, one word that defines powerful presence.

1:04:23SPEAKER_01:Inspiring.

1:04:26SPEAKER_02:Ooh, I like that. Yes. Toughest interview you have ever conducted or sat through.

1:04:36SPEAKER_01:Well, sometimes the toughest interviews are not. I mean, I could talk I could name a number of politicians, but I won't that are tough interviews because you know they just pivot on everything. Um, they never answer the question. But um one interview that I that I continue that comes into my head is the day I was on a show called Live at Five, and I'm interviewing this pot shot Spanish singer, like the he's the top of the charts in all of Europe.

1:05:07SPEAKER_01:And he was everybody's like, Woohoo! Anyway, so I sit, so I sit down with the guy and I say, um, I asked my first question, and he goes, He's not. And then he says, I like New York. And I went, Oh, that's not what I asked, but okay. And I said, you know, so I follow up with a few other questions, and he can't, look, two, two more questions. And all of a sudden I realized the guy doesn't speak English. And nobody, nobody, none of the producers had done a pre-interview to understand that.

1:05:36SPEAKER_01:And I don't, I don't speak Spanish. So it was, and I did, but the smartest thing that any anchor can ever do was just I said, Thank you so much for being here. You can buy his uh, you know, buy his album. It's called blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And we're going to do a commercial break. So, and then we get into the break, and I go, Did nobody figure out this guy doesn't speak English?

1:06:00SPEAKER_00:Oh my gosh.

1:06:03SPEAKER_01:Talk about a little bit of like.

1:06:05SPEAKER_00:Yeah. Well, that that's the the perfect segue into the next lightning round question, which is what is your go-to hype song before going on camera walking onto a stage?

1:06:19SPEAKER_01:Um, I like girls just want to have fun, which I think is is all of it. Or we are the champions by Queen. A couple of old songs, but they just inspire me to death.

1:06:32SPEAKER_02:I feel like that's our life theme song. Yes. Jane, finish this sentence. The people who get heard are the ones who dot dot dot listen well.

1:06:50unknown:Oh.

1:06:52SPEAKER_01:I like that a lot. They're not the ones with the loudest voices.

1:06:59SPEAKER_00:Well, Jane, we end every conversation thinking about the women who make the choice to listen into our shows. You know, maybe she's brilliant at what she does, maybe she has some grand idea, she knows the business, she's definitely earned her seat at the table. But when that moment comes for her to speak, whether that be in a meeting, a pitch, an interview on stage, on camera, whatever it is, something in her makes her pullback. And the mission of SheCommerce is about helping women to see what's possible and helping them build brands, careers, and we always say building each other up.

1:07:36SPEAKER_00:So for that woman who knows that she has something valuable to say, but is for some reason still afraid to say it, what do you want her to know?

1:07:49SPEAKER_01:I want her to get out of her own way and focus on her purpose. There are numerous studies about women that show once we focus on our purpose, because face it, we don't like to be braggart and say, oh, I did this, I did that, oh, I can do. We we're always wanting to make other people happy. So if you can can get out of your own head and focus on why you're there, what is your why? That will help you do a much better job and get rid of all of the butterflies in the stomach and and and whatever you're fearful of, then when you focus on your purpose, I also want you to accompany that with trust yourself.

1:08:35SPEAKER_01:You are where you are for a reason. Other people trust you. Why can't you trust yourself? So trust yourself to do the job well, and trust yourself to do a good job on a stage, a good job in an interview, a good job everywhere. Believe, give yourself the trust that you give to others because that's what's going to lead you up, you know, lead you to levels that you can't even possibly imagine.

1:09:02SPEAKER_00:Amen.

1:09:04SPEAKER_02:That is oh wow, I'm tattooing that. Are you where? Right there, right there. I'm gonna tattoo it every time I'm I'm I'm doubting myself. No, Jane said.

1:09:17SPEAKER_01:That's right. Well, you have to. You just have to. We're all here for a reason and let your reason shine through and then enjoy every minute of it. And have fun. Thank you, Jane. Yes, and have fun.

1:09:35SPEAKER_02:Always, always have fun. Because girls just wanna, right?

1:09:40SPEAKER_00:Girls just wanna. Oh, I like I like that.

1:09:45SPEAKER_02:Jane, with every episode of She Commerce, we are building this growing network of women leaders and advocates who don't just climb, we reach back. So we're officially inviting you to do the sisterhood. So will you take the She Commerce Pledge with us and pay it forward to amplify women's voices, advocate for the women around you, and help shape the future of commerce for females? Sure, why not?

1:10:14SPEAKER_01:Sounds like a good idea to me. We we we thought you might say yes. But only if you promise yes. But but only if you promise me that we will go back to Cannes next year and neither none of us are staying at that hotel. Oh, hell no.

1:10:30SPEAKER_00:Um absolutely not. We can definitely promise that. Definitely.

1:10:36unknown:Yes.

1:10:36SPEAKER_00:Um, Jane, thank you so much for being here with us and bringing all the wisdom, all the great stories that only you can tell, and hopefully saving ourselves um from just staring at ourselves at on the Zoom calls for the rest of our careers. Um, and those those great reminders that you gave us to believe in ourselves and listen more and have fun along the way. So appreciate it.

1:11:04SPEAKER_02:Seriously, Jane.

1:11:05SPEAKER_00:It's fun being here.

1:11:06SPEAKER_02:I look forward to seeing you guys soon. Thank you so much, Jane. We really appreciate your time, your candor, and your wisdom. And to everyone listening, the takeaway today is pretty simple. AI may help you find the words, technology may give you the platform, but your voice, your judgment, your ability to connect, that that's still yours.

1:11:32SPEAKER_00:So use it, speak up, take control of the room, and when another woman does the same, you make room for her too.

1:11:42SPEAKER_02:Because it's not just business.

1:11:45SPEAKER_00:It's personal.

1:11:49SPEAKER_02:Old brands, fierce women, one sisterhood.

1:11:53SPEAKER_00:Don't go yet. Keep listening for Jane's behind-the-scenes conversation.

1:12:05SPEAKER_01:Yeah. You know, um, you know what I was thinking about is I think it would be interesting to tell people how we met because you've got an audience of women. And I think um, I believe what it demonstrates is the ability of women to connect in really unusual ways and very quickly. And that didn't used to be the case, all those, you know, for many years where we were just absolute competitors in the, you know, in the business world. And now today we're all helping each other.

1:12:29SPEAKER_01:Perfect. I was gonna ask you about that because I was thinking about Gloria Steinem today. I know also and you know, how important she was for where we are in our life. Um so I just think did you get a chance to interview her ever? I did. And she was very close with somebody I used to work with, a woman named Carol Jenkins. Um, and who is Carol, I think, runs her the media center that they have that she created. Uh I can't remember what it's called at the top of the top of my head.

1:12:59SPEAKER_01:So um after I finish this, I want to write a note to Carol because I know she's really upset. Um, but you know, there's all these women that were just, you know, a generation plus above that I mean they really paved the way for so amazing. And we wouldn't be doing this. We would not be doing this today if it hadn't been for women Gloria Steinem.

1:13:21SPEAKER_02:Oh, absolutely. Yeah. 100%. But you know, you have the the you have two different polls um where you have Gloria Steinem, the this powerhouse, this fire who who made so many changes for us. And then you had, on the other hand, you had Dolly Parton, who was equally fabulous in a completely different way. So, I mean, she put the empathy in empathetic, you know. It just feels like all the good folks are are kind of like they've that's like it's like right, okay, we're done, we're leaving now.

1:13:54SPEAKER_02:We're gonna go have a party upstairs.

1:13:57SPEAKER_01:I've done my job. So yeah. I know. And and honestly, you know, one of the questions you have in here is about the presence, who's you know, who shows great presence, etc. And what you just defined are two women who were completely different, but they had profound effect.

1:14:16SPEAKER_03:Yeah.

1:14:16SPEAKER_01:And Dolly is the epitome of of allowing the vulnerability, allowing all of that, which is so important.

1:14:25SPEAKER_03:Yeah.

1:14:25SPEAKER_01:So yeah. Anyway, there we are. Here we are. Jane, you were amazing.

1:14:31SPEAKER_02:Oh my god.