Episode notes
Kath Madgwick has been to hell and back. One of the most recognisable faces of the Royal Commission into Robodebt, her only son Jarrad took his own life after being told he owed Services Australia nearly two thousand dollars. Kath has been fighting ever since. The royal commission report dedicated more than a page to her story. But now, Kath says she’s experiencing injustice of another kind. Booted out of the $475 million robodebt class action – her compensation claim over Jarrad’s death has been denied by the Commonwealth. Today Kath Madgwick, on how – even as one of…
Transcript
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Speaker 1:I wanted to start by just asking you a bit about your son, Jared. He was just 22 when he died. Can you tell me a bit about who he was?
Speaker 2:Yeah, when he left school, he went to uni to study psychology. He found that a bit depressing, so he then got a scholarship in writing.
Speaker 3:He was quite an intelligent boy.
Speaker 2:He was definitely lovely and loving, but he wasn't worldly, if you know what I mean. He was kind of naive to the world, but intelligent, yeah.
Speaker 4:Kath Madgwick has been to hell and back.
Speaker 3:It's taken a big toll. It's taken a huge toll.
Speaker 2:You know, even people that have known me for years, they can see that there's a sadness in me.
Speaker 3:I don't want to cry.
Speaker 4:One of the most recognisable faces of the Royal Commission into Brobo debt, her only son, Jared, took his own life after being told he owed Services Australia nearly $ 2, 000. Kath has been fighting ever since. The Royal Commission report dedicated over a page to her story, but now Kath says she's experiencing injustice of another kind. Booted out of the $ 475 million Robodeck class action, her compensation claim over Jared's death has been denied by the Commonwealth. I'm Ruby Jones, and you're listening to 7am. Today, Kath Madgwick on how, even as one of the worst affected victims of the Robodeck saga, she's somehow missed out. It's Monday, October 12.
Speaker 4:And a warning, this episode mentions suicide. Taff, your son, Jared, he died after being told he owed this debt to Centrelink of nearly $ 2, 000. Can you tell me a bit about that call and what happened?
Speaker 2:So originally I found Jared on the 1st of June. He'd taken his life on the 30th of May, which we'd had two families. lengthy phone calls with Centrelink that day and just before he died he mentioned this debt and that he wasn't going to get paid because of the debt. Jared had a loan that he got for a car and he had some fines. When he was told that he wasn't going to get paid because of this debt he thought he was going to default on his loans, he was probably going to go to jail for his fines and his life was ruined. You could see that he was feeling like he was a burden on me. You know, I happened to have lost my job, which was no fault of my own. They couldn't afford to keep me on. So I couldn't do anything about it for the first time in my life. It was like the perfect storm, really.
Speaker 4:And can you tell me a bit about the journey that you then went on, trying to find some answers and get accountability for what had happened?
Speaker 2:So once I found him, I then rang Centrelink and I questioned the debt. I questioned a whole heap of things because I didn't even know what robo debt was. But the debt definitely become one of my questions. Where did this debt come from? I was speaking to a social worker and he then hung up the phone, rang me on the fourth and.
Speaker 3:Said, oh, it was an old debt.
Speaker 2:We wiped it. I wrote letters to the Prime Minister and the Services Australia Minister and never got a response.
Speaker 3:So then I went to Emily.
Speaker 2:McPherson and told her the story and she alerted me that it could have been a robo-debt. Centrelink's robo-debt system has its critics and this mum wants it fixed.
Speaker 5:Kath says the controversial debt recovery scheme pushed her son over the edge.
Speaker 2:So she did the story, ended up on a current affair. Then they wanted to know me. Mm.
Speaker 4:And so after that story, you met with the Deputy Chief of Services Australia at the time.
Speaker 1:What were you told?
Speaker 2:So I had a meeting with Michelle Lees and she said there was no debt, which confused me greatly because I was.
Speaker 3:Like, how can you wipe a debt when there's no debt?
Speaker 2:You know, nothing was fitting together and I just kept pushing and pushing and pushing because they wouldn't give me the information I needed to put my mind at rest. which is something, when it's your child, you need to know the ins and outs of everything. And I knew it had something to do with him taking his life because there was nothing else happening in the house.
Speaker 6:Miss Madgwick, can you tell the Commission your full.
Speaker 4:Name, please?
Speaker 3:Kathleen Beryl Madgwick.
Speaker 6:And your son was Jared Madgwick?
Speaker 3:That's correct.
Speaker 2:So, yeah, then I went to the Royal Commission and gave evidence there. He came out and he said that now I'm not going to get paid because I owe them $ 2, 000.
Speaker 4:Getting to that Royal Commission, it took several years, but it did eventually happen.
Speaker 5:The Royal Commission into the robo-debt scandal has handed down its findings into the unlawful scheme, recommending its architects be referred for criminal and civil prosecution.
Speaker 4:How important was that for you?
Speaker 2:Really important. Really important for people to hear that. his story because it's really important to me, not only for his memory, but also I just hope that no other child goes through that, no other young person.
Speaker 4:And at the end of the Royal Commission, you and your son's story, it was all mentioned in the final report. And that report found that the way that he was informed about this potential debt with Centrelink, that was a precipitating factor in his death. And The report said his case, it exemplified a particular aspect of the scheme's brutality, which is this bold online statement to someone who already is in dire financial straits with no indication of how it might be repaid. That recognition of what had happened, that must have meant a lot.
Speaker 3:Oh, it meant the world.
Speaker 2:I really loved the Commissioner and the whole Royal Commission team.
Speaker 3:For the way that I was treated.
Speaker 2:For listening to my story and understanding what the story was. You know, I couldn't thank them enough. They were wonderful.
Speaker 4:And so when it was announced that the federal government were going to pay this additional compensation to 450,000 victims of the Robodebt scandal.
Speaker 6:In 2020, the federal government paid back the debts. Today, it's agreed to $ 475 million in compensation, as well as legal and admin fees, which could bring the total cost to over $ 548 million.
Speaker 1:What were your first thoughts then?
Speaker 2:Well, I was happy because people were going to get some money, right? And not that it's enough money for their pain and hurt that's caused but it's something and it's recognition that they did the wrong thing in.
Speaker 5:A landmark settlement in the federal court the largest class action settlement in australian history now the albanese government has decided not to defend the claim that public servants who ran the robo debt scheme acted unlawfully as brought on by gordon legal.
Speaker 2:I actually went online and i think i went crooked gordon legal for using jared's photo when he when i wasn't in the class action And then Gordon Legal contacted me and said that I could register for it.
Speaker 3:Okay.
Speaker 4:And so you were expecting that you would join the class action then? Yes.
Speaker 3:I did join the class action, yes.
Speaker 4:But then you received a letter from the Commonwealth's lawyers about whether you'd be entitled to compensation.
Speaker 3:What did it say?
Speaker 2:The official letter from the Commonwealth said that they denied that they rang Jarrod on that afternoon. And then it said that due to the fact that they'd waived the debt and it wasn't recoverable, that he wasn't entitled to be in the class action, which made me angry because the debt was a discrepancy to start with.
Speaker 1:Okay, so I'm clear.
Speaker 4:According to the Commonwealth, because Dara didn't receive this official debt notice, it was what they call a provisional estimate, then his family's not eligible for compensation. And Services Australia has also now kind of said that, they don't think that the debt outcome was actually calculated using income averaging.
Speaker 1:What do you make of all of this?
Speaker 2:Well, the fact is I believe Jared, they called him in that afternoon because otherwise the boogeyman told me. So, you know, Jared never lies to me and I don't think he was lying on that debt. So what they've done is they've asserted a debt that they hadn't checked yet over him on that afternoon. which then triggered him to take his own life.
Speaker 4:Still to come, are there any more avenues for justice? And so this response that you're getting now from the Commonwealth at the end of years of advocating, Yeah, tell me a bit about where you are at now.
Speaker 2:Well, there's nowhere else for me to go, to be honest. I know Gordon Legal is still arguing about keeping me in the class action, but at this stage they're getting the roadblocks that I'm getting.
Speaker 3:There is one more avenue.
Speaker 2:Jarrod's debt, the way it came about was it was a defective administration on their part. So there is another avenue which is compensation for defective administration and But Services Australia judge themselves on that. They can say, oh, no, we don't agree, and I'd just be going through another whole heap for nothing. I don't trust them. I think they're liars. And that's not a place I want to go. I don't want to go fighting the services of Australia again.
Speaker 2:It just, it's too hard. Yeah.
Speaker 1:Well, it's been seven years since Dara died, right?
Speaker 4:And you've spent all of those years writing to ministers, to departments, going to the then to get this news about compensation. Tell me a bit more about where you're left at in terms of trust or belief in the system or accountability.
Speaker 3:I hate the system.
Speaker 2:I think the system's really cruel.
Speaker 3:I mean, it's still happening.
Speaker 2:Look at the NDIS, aged care, they're still using all this automation.
Speaker 3:And it's hurting people.
Speaker 2:Look, honestly, if I had to rely on them for income, I'd rather die than go to see them. You know, and I'm helping people, you know, in their statement they said that, you know, they've changed the system and things like that. Well, I live 30 minutes from town and I've been helping people who cannot see, you know, have very little vision, cannot hardly hear, they're eligible for the pension and when you take them in there, they want them to get online.
Speaker 1:Not going to happen. Do you mind telling me a bit more about the impact that this has all had on you personally? I mean, it must have taken a toll.
Speaker 3:It's taken a big toll. It's taken a huge toll.
Speaker 2:You know, even people that have known me for years, they can see that there's a sadness in me.
Speaker 3:Don't want to cry.
Speaker 2:You know, even I've got PTSD, so I went into some community work, you know, dealing with Centrelink and dealing with all these departments was all too triggering for me, so I had to leave that. Because, you know, some days if my PTSD hits, I can be out for four days.
Speaker 3:I'm just not in a good space at all.
Speaker 2:And that's when everybody worries about me because I start to think I can't do this anymore. But I'm usually all right. I just pull myself out of it. But it's hard. It's hard yakka.
Speaker 3:And I don't know whether that'll ever stop.
Speaker 1:Do you feel like there has been... any accountability or any justice?
Speaker 3:No, not for Jared. Not at all.
Speaker 2:I mean, how would they feel if that was their child?
Speaker 3:This is my child. This is my life.
Speaker 1:I'm sorry, Kath, and thank you for talking to me about it.
Speaker 3:That's all right.
Speaker 2:Thanks, Ruby.
Speaker 4:If this story has raised any issues for you, you can contact Lifeline on 13 11 14. Also in the news, humans could be extinct by the year 2100 thanks to nuclear conflict or malicious use of AI. That's according to a new global risk assessment by the Lancet Commission on 21st Century Global Threats to Health. Also on the list of major threats to humans, the climate crisis, childhood malnutrition and cuts to aid spending by wealthy countries. And death row inmate Krista Pike is back in prison after a stay in hospital following her botched execution in the US.
Speaker 4:Her lawyers say she has a long recovery ahead of her after surviving two lethal injections. Tennessee has suspended all executions for the rest of the year while investigations into the incident continue. I'm Ruby Jones. This is 7am.
Speaker 3:Thanks for listening.
Speaker 6:Music Thank you.
Transcript supplied by the publisher with the episode.
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