How micropractices make life better, with Eli Susman

0:03Speaker 1:Welcome to Before Breakfast, a production of iHeartRadio. Good morning.

0:10Speaker 2:This is Laura.

0:11Speaker 3:Welcome to the Before Breakfast podcast. Today's episode is going to be a slightly longer one, part of the series where I interview fascinating people about how they take their days from great to awesome and any advice they have.

0:24Speaker 2:For the rest of us.

0:25Speaker 3:So today I am delighted to welcome Eli Sussman to Before Breakfast. Eli is a psychologist and the author of the brand new book, Micropractice.

0:33Speaker 1:Eli, welcome to the show.

0:35Speaker 2:Thank you for having me, Laura.

0:37Speaker 3:I'm so excited you could be here. Why don't you tell our listeners a little bit about yourself?

0:41Speaker 2:Yeah, so I am a psychologist by training. So I got my PhD at Berkeley and I think one thing that really got me into this work was through my own experience as a meditation practitioner. I was on a meditation retreat when I went up to a monk and told him that I just meditated for three hours. And he looked at me and said, three hours? And Then he smiled and he says that I'll never forget. How about three breaths? That's all you need to tune into the present moment. And I remember thinking, oh, here I was having walked over like I just killed spiritual Everest.

1:44Speaker 2:And with one gentle question, he helped me see that I've been measuring the wrong thing entirely. It was humbling, but also incredibly freeing because most of us aren't short on good intentions. We're short on time. We mean to meditate. And then, you know, the meeting runs late. Dinner needs making. Notification pops up. And before you know it, we're five videos deep on Instagram and two goldfish driving a go-kart. And it made me wonder, what if something as quick as three breaths, something that takes just 30 seconds or less, could actually make a difference in people's lives? And that really became the through line of my research at Harvard and UC Berkeley and And I found that doing just 20 seconds a day of a practice I developed called self-compassion and touch, which basically involves things like placing your hand over your heart and belly paired with a kind inner voice. Doing that for 20 seconds a day was associated with greater improvement in self-compassion, stress, and emotional well-being with effects comparable to what we see with much more time-intensive interventions. And that's really what led me to coin

2:54Speaker 2:the term micro practice, which I really define as well-being practices that don't add anything more than 30 seconds to what you're already doing. Go ahead.

3:05Speaker 3:Well, because we can always find 30 seconds. I mean, I feel in my life, people are always like, I have no time whatsoever. Well, we all have small bits of time here and there.

3:14Speaker 2:Totally.

3:15Speaker 1:Yeah.

3:15Speaker 2:And that's the whole thing is that We have all of these tiny windows in our day. It could be waiting for the microwave to ring as you're warming up your oatmeal or waiting for standing in line for coffee and just taking a moment to feel your feet on the ground, notice the smells, or even just feeling the ground beneath your feet on your way to work Like all these different moments that are just waiting to be noticed, to just feel alive in. And that's really what micro practice is all about. It's approach that I think of it as an approach to well-being that doesn't ask for more of your time, but helps you unlock the power in the moments you already have.

4:06Speaker 3:And you have a quote in the book that consistency, not the clock drives change. Can you talk about what that means?

4:13Speaker 2:Yeah. So, you know, after that study that I mentioned, you know, when I looked more closely at the research, I kept seeing the same pattern, which was that, you know, it's not about how much time you spend, but how consistent you are that actually predicts the best outcomes when it comes to well-being practices. And, you know, that's such a relief because we tend to think that doing more is always better than But often making a practice shorter is exactly what helps us keep coming back to it.

4:47Speaker 2:So that's really a big part of why I wrote this book. And because that consistency is where the real change happens.

4:57Speaker 3:And you've referenced some research that, I mean, short is fine. In fact, short is often better. That sometimes... shorter meditations were more effective than longer? Was this because people were just more consistent with it? Or what was that driving the difference there?

5:14Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, well, for the first piece, you know, on consistency, you know, shrinking a practice definitely makes it easier to do that. I remember one study where they, you know, asked like one group to meditate for 10 minutes a day for two weeks and the other group to ask for were asked to meditate for 20 minutes a day for two weeks. And, uh, the 20 minute group only, uh, you know, they were assigned to double the amount of practice, but they only practiced a quarter more than the 10 minute group. Um, and you know, the 10 minute group, uh, you know, um, and, and we see this like across studies, you know, when, uh, you know, the, the shorter, like shorter practices, uh, aren't necessarily any less effective than longer ones. One of my favorite examples around this is they did this study of 21,000 Headspace members, which is a mindfulness app. And what I love about this study is they were able to, because it's a mindfulness app, they could objectively track both how long people practiced and how consistently they practiced. And more consistent practice, you know, like we were talking about,

6:36Speaker 2:you know, was associated with better reduced stress, but longer sessions had no association. And, you know, I think part of the reason for that is, you know, in addition to just, you know, making your practice shorter is easier to do, kind of goes to this idea that, and, you know, it can vary for different practices, but there's this phenomenon that psychologists call habituation, which is essentially, you know, when your nervous system adapts to something, you know, the longer that, you know, it stays with it. So you can think of it kind of like jumping into a swimming pool, right? Like that first plunge in the cold water your whole body lights up. Sharp, electric, alive, but stay in for a minute. And what happens? The cold disappears.

7:35Speaker 2:The water hasn't changed, but you have. That's what nervous system does. It gets used to what stays the same, which means that things always feel calm, safe, and connected. Might work best when we keep refreshing the signal. And that would be part of my micro practice works. Tiny moments that keep resetting the signal again and again.

7:53Speaker 3:All right, well, we're going to take a quick ad break and then we'll be back with more about micro practices. Well, I am back talking with Eli Sussman, who is the author of the new book, Micro Practice.

8:10Speaker 1:So Eli, you have four.

8:11Speaker 3:Areas in the book where you talk about how we can develop micro practices for reducing stress and feeling better. Move, touch, breath, and flow. So I want to talk about some practical strategies we could do in each of them because this podcast is all about things we can put into practice in the next day or so to make our lives better. So what is your favorite micro practice in the category of moving?

8:36Speaker 2:Yeah, so I mean, That's a hard one because I mean, I'll go with micro yoga because I mean, I'm sure we'll get to this later, but yoga is a big part of my morning routine. And, you know, it's something, you know, for a lot of us who spend time sitting at a desk, you know, it can really help counteract that computer pose and And just prolonged sitting in general is associated with poor health. And there was one study that showed they gave people 15 to 30-second stretch breaks every 15 minutes across the workday. And compared to people who didn't have those breaks, the stretch group was 15% more productive. which might not sound like much, but over the course of a year, that adds up to seven extra work weeks of time.

9:47Speaker 3:So what is a micro yoga? Does that just mean doing a pose for like 30 seconds? I mean, what are we talking about here? Yeah.

9:53Speaker 2:So I can walk you through one if you'd like.

9:56Speaker 3:Well, tell us about like, what is one micro yoga pose that people could do?

10:00Speaker 2:Yeah, so, you know, one of my favorites is what I call the fish pose, or it's also what it's called in yoga. But it basically, you know, just involves, you know, you can like sit at the edge of your chair or stand up. and just interlace your fingers behind your back. If they don't reach, you can just hold the towel or just let your hands hang. And as you inhale, reaching your hands up and back, and as you exhale, just keeping your spine long, letting the front of your body open, maybe your head and chin tilts back. And then with each inhale, Extending your arms further up and back. And with each exhale, sinking deeper into the stretch. And then just releasing and just noticing what comes up.

11:03Speaker 3:And that sort of opens up the front because if we've been hunched over our computers, that sort of opens up the chest and stretches the other direction there.

11:11Speaker 2:Okay, fascinating.

11:11Speaker 3:Fascinating. Let's talk about touch. How about there? I was curious what the idea of a meditative hug.

11:17Speaker 1:What is a meditative hug? Yeah.

11:19Speaker 2:So hugging meditation is, you know, it can be something that, you know, both people are on board with or, you know, I call this like the everyday embrace. You know, you can just.

11:32Speaker 3:You can unilaterally have a meditative hug with somebody.

11:35Speaker 2:And, you know, it doesn't need to be like, you know, super... different in any way it's more just like allowing yourself to just really pay attention you know to that moment and and like savor it um uh you know one of the like there are studies that show that you know just doing that for 20 seconds can uh just once can reduce your your cortisol levels that's awesome All right.

12:04Speaker 3:And how about breath? I'm a big fan of singing. It turns out that singing is a micro practice. We just sing for 30 seconds or so?

12:12Speaker 2:Yeah. Or you can also do it just like while you're doing something else, right? Like a song while you wash the dishes or a song, maybe instead of playing music in your car for a moment, you just sing your own song. It can be a song that you know, or, you know, it can just be something that you improvise or make up or just do random sounds and just focus on the melody. And because, you know, improvisation kind of has its own kind of playfulness quality to it as well that, you know, carries its own creativity and well-being benefits with it.

12:56Speaker 3:And then how about in the category of flow? What's a micro practice people could try there?

13:01Speaker 2:Yeah. So one that I really like is called everyday loving kindness. And it basically involves sending well wishes to people that you encounter throughout your day, just like in your mind. And, you know, it doesn't need to be any phrase in particular, although like some people People use phrases like, you know, may you be safe, may you be happy, may you be healthy, may you live with ease. Or just using one word like safe, happy, healthy, ease. Or you can even just notice the feeling, tune into the feeling of what it would be like to be around that person as like a five-year-old child or smiling in like the light of the golden glow of a sunset.

13:55Speaker 3:Right.

13:55Speaker 2:And there's, there's something about those things that just have a way of, um, you know, seeing the, the aliveness and in the person in front of us. Um, and you know, there's studies showing that doing that kind of like everyday loving kindness, just like as you go about your day, you know, people, uh, you know, standing in line in the grocery store, walking on the street, um, you know, that, that is, uh, associated with, um, uh, better well-being.

14:28Speaker 3:All right. So we've got a couple of practical things here we're going to do. We're going to do our fish stretch, sitting on the edge of our chair and opening our chest. We are going to have a meditative hug with somebody today. We're going to sing and we're going to send good, loving wishes to the people around us. This sounds doable, but of course, building habits is hard, as you know. This is the perennial problem with self-improvement, that we have great ideas and then we don't stick with them. It seems that micro practices would be easy, but how can we actually get from knowing these things are easy to doing them?

15:00Speaker 2:Yeah, so that is really what my dissertation was about. And there's a whole chapter in the book about how to make these practices and habits, like more than 25 different tools, and also how to do it you know, when we don't even feel like we have a moment to pause, right? We feel too busy because, you know, one of the most surprising things to me was that people in that first micro practice study that I was mentioning, you know, the Berkeley college students who were participating, you know, one of the most common barriers people reported was that they're too busy for 20 seconds. You know, which at first is like, oh, come on, like, 20 seconds early, but you know, it's like this mindset that we have that like every pause is something you have to justify. So, you know, there are kind of three key ingredients to habit formation. The first is cues. So these are like the signals in your environment to tell your brain it's time to act. You know, it's helpful to have a cue that's specific. It can be something like an event in your day, like, you know, after I brush my teeth in the bathroom in the morning, I'll do the practice. Or,

16:20Speaker 2:you know, when I'm sitting down to drink my morning coffee, you know, I will just take a moment to really enjoy even that first sip, right? It could be the whole mug, but it could just be that first sip, right? And that's your cue. The next ingredient is rewards. So, you know, when something feels good, we're more likely to keep doing it. So one way that you can like kind of max, like increase the reward value of something is just like taking a moment to savor it, let it land. Or also, you know, micro practices can pair especially well with things you already enjoy. You know, maybe you're up early and there's a sunrise in the morning.

17:09Speaker 2:That could pair really well with just mindfulness, right? Like taking a moment to just really enjoy the colors and the glow of the sunset. And then the last thing is repetition. So doing it again and again, like the more you do it, the more the cue will be paired with the behavior to the point where the cue just starts cueing the behavior on its own without you really having to think about it as much. And one thing that actually I think works really well for you know, morning folks is, uh, there's, there's actually studies showing that, you know, doing, um, doing meditation in, uh, of any time in the day, like if, if you choose the morning time, that's when it's most likely to stick. Um, and you know, it doesn't have to be like morning, morning, like in the AM, you know, if you're, if you're up at 12 PM and that, you know, that's your morning routine. It's more about the place that it's at in your day. And we find that morning is kind of like the Switzerland of your day. It's calm and neutral and stable, right? So doing practices during that can be especially fruitful for developing habits. Yeah, we like that.

18:32Speaker 3:Morning is a state of mind, whatever time it happens to start. It doesn't have to start at 4 a.m. If you're up at 11 a.m., then that's your morning routine.

18:38Speaker 2:That is great.

18:39Speaker 3:We're going to take one more quick ad break, and then I'll be back with more from Eli Sussman. Well, I am back talking with Eli Sussman, who is a psychologist, author of the new book, Micropractice, all about small 20-second practices you can put into your life to boost your well-being. Um, so we've been talking mornings, uh, many people listening to the show have a morning routine. Eli, do you have a morning routine? Yeah.

19:08Speaker 2:You know, it's kind of, uh, my partner always, uh, who actually illustrated the book. She, she, uh, she, uh, often makes fun of me because of how like unshakable it is. Um, I've been doing the same morning routine for, you know, in different variations of it for like at least 10 years. Um, And, uh, you know, it's kind of evolved a little bit over time, but, uh, you know, generally I wake up and, uh, I have, uh, I make myself like, uh, a matcha. Um, I prefer that over coffee because, there are studies showing that it can actually help prolong the release of caffeine and kind of create less of a crash later. And monks actually drink it before they meditate too, because it can help promote alpha waves in our brain, which are associated with calm and focus and things like that. So after I do that, you know, while that's kind of, uh, you know, running its course, uh, I'll, uh, make my breakfast. I have like my own, uh, homemade like kefir smoothie. I, um, and, uh, you know, then I'll take a shower and, you know, one micro practice that I've, I've started using, uh, there, um, you know, just, just like trying to, you know, really, uh,

20:39Speaker 2:shower as if, you know, I'm someone who like really cares about myself.

20:43Speaker 3:Right.

20:44Speaker 2:Um, you know, how, what would it be like to, to shower, uh, someone who really cares about yourself? Um, and then I also, uh, end the shower with 30 seconds of cold, uh, cause there's studies showing that, you know, doing that can, uh, reduce stress. And also, um, there was one study where a it reduced sick days from work by 29%. And then after that, I, you know, even though I write about micro practices, I talk in the book about how, you know, these aren't meant to, like these don't have to replace a longer practice if you have those and they benefit you, like it can, but it can be a way of bringing that continuity into the rest of your day. So for me, you know, I still have like a longer yoga practice, you know, and meditation practice, before I got really into this micro practice research and work, I used to do an hour of yoga in the morning and an hour of meditation in the morning. Now it's like less than half of that.

21:54Speaker 2:I probably do the whole thing, yoga and meditation in like 45 minutes. I'll do like a half an hour or so of yoga and then. Uh, you know, the rest meditation, uh, you know, sometimes it's shorter than that. Sometimes it's longer than that. You know, if I have more time, like on a weekend or something, I'll, I'll try to do that. Um, but, uh, you know, it's, and, you know, then I go about my day and I, it's really become an anchor for me and just really, uh, enjoy it. Yeah.

22:31Speaker 3:Um, so what is, this is something I ask all my guests, but what is something you've done recently to take a day from great to awesome?

22:38Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, this morning, after I made my matcha, I just sat down and, you know, nothing else was going on. And I just enjoyed drinking it. And, you know, I think any time where I'm just fully present with what I'm doing, you know, sometimes the most meaningful thing about a day or morning is that you didn't miss it. That's good advice.

23:11Speaker 3:Be there and be present for it. So Eli, where can people find you?

23:15Speaker 2:Yeah, you can learn more about the book and about the work I do at micropractice.com. That's one word, no dashes. I also write a free newsletter about the latest science on micropractice and how to make micropractices or, you know, can really apply to any practice into a habit. And you can find that both on the website, micropractice.com, and also on my Substack, which is micropractice.substack.com.

23:49Speaker 3:Awesome. Well, please check that out. Eli, thank you so much for joining us. Thank you to everyone for listening. If you have feedback about this or any other episode, you can always reach me at laura at lauravandercam.com. In the meantime, this is Laura. Thanks for listening. And here's to making the most of our time. Thanks for listening to Before Breakfast.

24:17Speaker 1:If you've got questions, ideas, or feedback, you can reach me at laura at lauravandercam.com. Before Breakfast is a production of iHeartMedia. For more podcasts from iHeartMedia, please visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

24:46Speaker 2:Thank you.