In All Honesty

0:10Speaker 1:You're listening to a Mamma Mia podcast. Mamma Mia acknowledges the traditional owners of the land and waters this podcast is recorded on. We spend a lot of time talking and thinking about romantic relationships, searching for and finding that one person who'll enrich your life, who'll choose you and only you, even change your last name. But what about friendships? Those deep, unbreakable bonds. The ones who make your life better without the strings attached. Those soulmate-level best friends. They're the person you call with good news. The one you laugh and cry with. The one you run to when your heart is broken. They know your secrets, your history, your dreams, every side and every version of you. You just couldn't imagine life without them. But you don't have to, because you know through all of life's ups and downs, the good times and the bad, they'll always be there.

1:06Speaker 1:Won't they? I'm Georgia Love and this is Everyone Has an Ex-Best Friend. Come with me as we dive into a collection of stories about friendships past, through the eyes and the hearts of the very people who lived them. There's a very specific kind of friendship that really only happens once, the one you fall into at 16, when you think you know who you are but haven't quite figured it out exactly. And for Chloe, that friendship had a soundtrack.

1:42Speaker 2:So we met in high school. We were in the same kind of mutual group. We became instant best friends. One of the first times we started talking and hanging out a lot more kind of outside of school is we both were going to a certain concert. We both really liked this band and we both were going to this band and found out that each other were there. We bumped into each other there. Like I was with my sister, she was with her sister. And after that, we both got like T-shirts of the band and then we both wore it and got to kind of connect in that way and then became closer and closer. We got a fair few more classes together and so we started hanging out a lot more. We had music together and then we started doing like some guitar and stuff in those classes and we also, we weren't very good and would always kind of distract each other and distract people around us. We had maths class together and we used to just call each other friction buddies because we didn't like fractions and all this different stuff. So we would be absolute ridiculous, silly people together and would make really dumb jokes, doing stupid things and we wouldn't really

2:45Speaker 2:care how we looked to anyone. We just always were having a lot of fun and being silly. She had her license before I did and she had a really nice car and we would drive around and we would do weird dances in the car, you know, normal teenage stuff. She was probably one of the silliest, funniest people that I knew. She really let me kind of let my guard down completely and really had like an effortless kind of way of connecting. Like we would just be absolute goofballs.

3:15Speaker 1:Fraction buddies, car dancing, matching band tees, their friendship was indestructible. So who was Jess? Ask Chloe back then and she'd have told you fiercely loyal, the kind of friend who'd tell you the truth to your face rather than talk about you behind your back.

3:30Speaker 2:She was someone that is quite loyal and protective of her friends. So she wouldn't be afraid to kind of confront you and, you know, really be that honest kind of person, which I definitely appreciated because she wouldn't be talking about you behind your back or anything to other people. She'd just be like straight up in your face and telling you. And that was obviously something that I really valued as well. She was very kind and caring. She really would take notice in detail of a lot of different things. You know, if someone was struggling or, you know, I was struggling with something or wasn't happy about something, she would really support you and really try and be there for you no matter what. And yeah, look after all her friends. She was very fiercely loyal and she was a fierce good friend. She was very proud of the fact that she cared about her friends. She made a lot of time and effort for them as well.

4:21Speaker 2:Jess was always the person that was organizing, reaching out to everyone, checking in if people were having a hard time, making sure that we bought something for someone's birthday, organizing accommodation for a group holiday. She was always that person putting in a lot of effort and making sure that everyone was getting together. She was a list person. She was like very detail orientated. And I think that sometimes she would get annoyed at me because I wasn't the best at organising or planning ahead of time. I just kind of lived in the moment a little bit more, whereas she was, you know, much more like wanting to plan things ahead of time. Like she would be asking me questions about what I'm doing on a certain time or a certain date so far in advance. I was like, I have no idea. I'm not even thinking about that yet.

5:04Speaker 2:Like my brain's not there. And whereas she would just be like trying to plan ahead.

5:09Speaker 1:But not everyone was sold on Jess.

5:12Speaker 2:My sister was quite nerdy and I was more in the popular group. And she just felt like that sometimes Jess was kind of attacking her a little bit. She would defend it by going, I'm just being honest, even if you kind of did get upset. She's like, I would want you to tell me. I would forgive a lot of those things because I knew that she was as hard on herself as she was being on everyone around her. And it wasn't necessarily, didn't seem like she was trying to do it to people, just bring them down.

5:39Speaker 2:But she would notice the negative things in life. She would always be pointing those out. Whereas I'm someone that really looks on the positive side of life. She often couldn't take that feedback though, when you would tell her and bring things up with her. She would overthink things. She'd really like overanalyze different situations and really kind of dig into things. And she definitely admitted that she wasn't always happy. She did kind of admit that she was probably a bit depressed and anxious. And she did seek out help for that as well.

6:10Speaker 1:Jess was sweet, protective, endlessly organised. But she was also 17, working out who she was, same as anyone that age. And nothing tests a teenage friendship quite like a run of milestone 18ths.

6:23Speaker 2:She turned 18 before me and I was very excited. I dropped her out for her first night. I just got my license. Dropped her out for her first night out on the town and then, you know, helped her pick her dress. We celebrated her 18th. We had a massive party. I did a big speech for her and everything. So then coming to my 18, it was my first night going out on the town and we were out. We had a great night. I went out at midnight because it was Thursday night and you got shots for $ 2 back then. So we went out at midnight as soon as I turned 18 and we had a really fun night. We were dancing the night away. And then about 3 a.m. we were sitting out the back of the pub and she just kind of started telling me things that she didn't like about me and how I could improve and be better. She brought up the fact that I didn't make the best career choices at school, that I don't reply to things that I wasn't happy about.

7:19Speaker 2:you know, my weight, but wasn't doing anything about it. I wasn't going to the gym with her, that I wasn't looking after myself. She was really just tearing down pretty much anything she could. could see how I could be doing so much better and that now I'm 18, I should really try and do better and be better. I was visibly crying, visibly upset, like absolutely devastated from what she was saying. And she just kept going and going and other people were there as well. So they saw it happen. And I ended up leaving and going home after that because there's no way I could go back out dancing and having fun when she was being quite awful. And then the next day, I guess she messaged me and she did apologize. And I didn't reply straight away. But I do remember then I kind of ended up just sweeping it on the rug and kind of letting it go.

8:08Speaker 1:Swept under the rug. It's a phrase you're going to want to remember because it's about to become something of a theme as a birthday.

8:15Speaker 2:So the next year, I also started dating someone that she didn't like that much so she would often tell me that he was not a good match for me during the next year though we still we had a lot of fun times you know we went to our first festival together you know we had a great group of friends we went to a fair few house parties these guys that lived down the road from me and we had a lot of fun and then on my 19th birthday oh I was living with my partner at that time that she didn't really like and a few of his friends were there She couldn't find her phone.

8:51Speaker 2:So she straight away was accusing his friends of stealing her phone. And she was like, tell me where they live. And I said, she's like, tell me their addresses now. And I said, I don't actually have their direct addresses. I can tell you where they live because who knows someone's actual address. You know, I can tell you go straight down the street, left down the street and you'll find it. But I was like, I don't know the actual house number or the street. And she called me out, said that I was lying and trying to protect my partner and his friends. And then I didn't care about her.

9:22Speaker 2:And she just absolutely flipped it in front of a lot of people at her house. She's like, you're dating a guy that, you know, he's got these loser friends and they've stolen my phone and you just keep making bad choices for yourself. So I worked in hairdressing and wasn't really enjoying it. I was getting really sore wrists. So I wasn't able to do it as much anymore. And she was telling me once again that, you know, I wasn't doing a good career move, that I really should stick with it. or I should get an office job.

9:51Speaker 2:So she once again was telling me everything that she didn't like about me. I ended up yelling at her to leave. I just was like, I'm not doing this again. Get out. And I kind of stood up for myself quite a bit then and said, just get out and leave. That night, I still went out and didn't let it affect me as much. After yelling at her to just get out, I had some really good friends around me that were all really supportive and were like, don't worry about her. Like, let's go out and have a really good time. And we did, which was really nice. Then when we got home, I found her phone under the couch.

10:27Speaker 2:So I just dropped it in her letterbox and let her sister know that it was there for her so that it was never stolen. After that night, I realized that I didn't want to be as close with her anymore and that I had some really good people around me. And I had really good friends that said that I wasn't this awful person that she made me out to be. So we didn't speak for a couple of years. We'd see each other here and there at different things, but we weren't close anymore and we wouldn't speak and she actually moved to Melbourne. And about a year after she moved to Melbourne, I ended up in Melbourne as well.

11:03Speaker 2:And we did bump into each other a few times out. And she was really lovely and saying she just really misses me as a friend. She was really apologetic. And I think that that time from us not being friends for a couple of years, she really did miss that. And she made a lot of effort and was really kind to me. I didn't straight away let her fully back into my life. It did take me a lot of time. We ended up kind of reconnecting and went to a few concerts together and a festival and And we ended up becoming quite close again. And then her and her boyfriend broke up and I had already moved back home to Newcastle and she ended up moving back to Newcastle as well. And we were pretty much from then back to being best friends and spending all our time together. We were both single. So we were both like really in our single girl era and having a lot of fun. And it was a really fun time.

11:58Speaker 2:But I feel like we probably reconnected once she became single again as well. And she was making a lot of effort, being really kind, you know, doing really lovely things for me. So that was really nice. We had a lot of mutual friends from high school. Obviously, we kind of had grown up and made other friends as well. We did have one little core group that they completely understood where I came from and what happened. They were still friends with her. I had no problem with that when we weren't friends. Obviously, they were really happy when we did become close again because then we were able to all hang out together. But I think a lot of people did keep a bit of a safe distance from her because they knew how she could be if you were too close to her.

12:38Speaker 1:But there were still some of the old habits that never went away.

12:41Speaker 2:One of the main things is she'd always say that I was leaving her out. So I had made other friends and had a big friendship circle and she would often get quite upset or annoyed if she wasn't invited or included in everything I was doing, which was really hard. I mean, I would invite her to a lot of things and definitely... I really made her be in part of my other friendship groups that I kind of had made during that time we weren't friends. And she would often say that when we were even in those friendship groups.

13:13Speaker 2:And so I invited her to a birthday dinner with everyone. And she came and then after the next day, she'd send me a message saying that I didn't include her in any conversations I just turned my back to her I was trying to leave her out and for me I was like that's not my intention or I'm so sorry if I've done that or made you feel that way So the next time we were at a group thing all together with this same group, I noticed that she was on her phone in the corner. And so I was like, I need to make an effort to bring her into the conversation and make more of an effort.

13:48Speaker 2:So I was like, hey, come over and like, hey, Jess, come over and chat with us about this. Like, what do you think of this? And she in front of everyone kind of stood up and was like, you've just been leaving me out and barely speaking to me all night. stormed out in front of everyone. And that was super embarrassing for me because all my friends, that group of girls, they were like, she's not very nice to you. There's a reason that you don't need to babysit her. You have invited her. You've made that effort. You don't need to then sit and make her have conversations like you're not a babysitter. And then when you do, she gets angry and they just were like, oh, they just This group of girls I'm still really close with now, they're just like, she's just absolutely ridiculous. Like, that's not your job to do that. They just don't have any drama, nothing like that. We all just get along so well.

14:36Speaker 2:So for them to kind of, they would make a real effort with her because of the fact that they knew for me it would kind of be hard if they didn't, I guess. The reason that maybe I would accept this is because it wasn't all the time. All of these, they were in between really nice things. So she would be spoiling me, organizing everyone to go together on a gift for me for my birthday. But then she would be making little comments and like really tearing me down. And the thing is as well, she wasn't intentionally a bad person and I knew that. She was as hard on me as she was on herself. So I knew that it was never intentional for her to be trying to make me feel like a really bad person.

15:16Speaker 2:It's just that she was... obviously not feeling good about herself and felt like she was being left out. That was her perspective. She felt like that I wasn't writing back to her. I wasn't making an effort. And it was actually a reflection on how she felt about herself, not me. So I think I excused a lot of the behavior for a long time because I knew that she wasn't that happy and with anxiety and depression, you know, I wanted to be there for her. I wanted to help her realize that You know, she is a fun, great person. So it was hard because we would have a lot of fun and she'd be a great friend.

15:46Speaker 2:But in the other turn, then she would be really harsh and critical. So it's like a weird dynamic. I knew with her anxiety and depression, she was that harsh and critical on herself. It wasn't... How awful she was to me. You know, she was that awful to herself behind closed doors. And I think a lot of people didn't see how bad kind of self-worth she had. Whereas I did know because I was in that inner circle and I really did know. So I knew that she was probably 10 times meaner to herself than what she was to me, which was really sad. I would though bring up things for her and that she was doing that would upset me. She would kind of get quite upset and then really down on herself. So it became really hard as well to say, you've done this, it's upset me because then she'd be really awful to herself then as well. So it also was hard. I just tried to keep it really positive and tried to kind of be that bright, bubbly, fun person that would hang out.

16:42Speaker 1:That was the shape of things for the next little while until Jess decided to put some real distance between them. Literally, she went to Asia for a month.

16:50Speaker 2:One of our mutual friends, Mia, was living there and so they met up and did some travelling around together. So she was spending a lot of time with Mia in Asia and we were exchanging messages, still talking, and she was kind of letting me know though that she was feeling like Mia was leaving Jess out of things, that they were going off and weren't always inviting her. She got sick at one point and they still went out without her. And she was kind of getting upset about that and talking to me about messaging me saying that she felt like that they were leaving her out.

17:25Speaker 2:And it really made me realize that how much she was just doing it to whoever she was close to that This is normally what she's saying about me, but she's saying it to me now because I'm not there. So it made me really feel validated in the fact that it wasn't just me and it was also just anyone that she's close with, they're never going to kind of be good enough. While she was over in Asia, I did... really realised how much of a weight had been lifted and how much better I felt when she wasn't constantly around telling me who I could hang out with or making me feel pressure about not inviting her or leaving her out of things.

18:06Speaker 1:Then, while Jess was still overseas, something happened that would put everything to the test.

18:12Speaker 2:While she was in Asia, I found out I was pregnant and I didn't message her about it for a little while because I just knew that she'd kind of have something to say about it. I did end up messaging her about it and I had decided to have an abortion. So the day that she got back from Asia was the day I was going in for my appointment. Her first words to me when she saw me after not seeing me for months, knowing what I was going through, was that she said that she doesn't have any sympathy for me. I bought this on myself. I didn't want sympathy from her. I wanted support. I think in that moment, I almost didn't really realise or register what she said because I was obviously in my own head about to go into this procedure. I honestly didn't quite register with me until later. One of my friends picked me up from that appointment and we had such a lovely time together afterwards. You know, she went and bought me my favorite food and we had a really lovely time. And it kind of made me reflect on what Jess had said to me earlier. And I kind of repeated it.

19:17Speaker 2:And my friend's face was like, I can't believe she said that to you. And that kind of helped validate as well, made me realize how bad that was.

19:25Speaker 1:And it didn't stop there.

19:27Speaker 2:Soon after that, that's when I got a haircut and she said that it looked awful.

19:31Speaker 1:Or even there.

19:32Speaker 2:I did find out after the abortion that I have a rare blood type. And so I have to get a needle if I ever decide to have a baby, because if my baby has a different blood type to me, it'll try and kill the baby. And I sent her a message about this and she said, it sounds made up. How do you know you have that? And I said, it's definitely not made up. So I just sent her a photo of the information sheet that I got given at the hospital for it. And she just wrote, oh, I guess it is real. Well, it's nothing to worry about.

20:03Speaker 2:And I kind of started realizing and setting apart. There's a difference between being harsh and, you know, being honest. And there's a big difference between that and being awful.

20:14Speaker 1:Chloe was still reeling from one of the hardest decisions of her life. Jess, meanwhile, had already moved on. to more important matters.

20:21Speaker 2:She started telling me that then she was trying to plan her birthday soon after that.

20:27Speaker 1:Oh dear, another birthday.

20:28Speaker 2:Oh, she was very birthday orientated. She got really annoyed at me and sent me a really long message about how no one was making an effort in the group chat to book accommodation for her birthday. And I said, look, you know, I'm going through a lot at the moment. I'm not really in the headspace to be booking accommodation and everything. I'm happy to come. Look, I'm sorry you feel that way. I'll make more effort. And she just kept on kind of going on about this. I explained I was not going the best mentally. And she said, yes, but you're not making an effort for my birthday. So that was cementing the fact that I kind of wasn't wanting to be close with her anymore because it was really hurtful to me. We did have conversations about it because I was kind of starting to stand up for myself and saying, you know, I'm not leaving you out of things. I'm allowed to have other friends. And we had kind of decided that we were distancing ourselves from a little bit. And then I went out with some of my girlfriends. And one of them in particular, she really didn't like. We bumped into each other at the

21:35Speaker 2:shops and said, let's go get a champagne and just like have a catch up. And then we put something on our story on Instagram and she straight away replied to my story saying, wow, you didn't invite me, of course. So the next day I messaged her and said, look, I don't know why you needed to say that. And she said, yeah, look, I just can't believe you wouldn't invite me. And I said, look, I bumped into her, number one. Number two, we were saying we were having some space from each other and Number three, you don't even like this girl that I was with. And she said, I know I don't like her, but I still would have appreciated an invite. And from there, then she said, I don't even think I want to go away for my birthday anymore. It seems like no one wants to go and just kind of made it a lot about her.

22:19Speaker 2:And I was going through stuff as well. And I think for once I was like, well, no, I'm going through stuff as well, but I'm not like going to take it out and make everyone else feel bad. I really was trying to make an effort, but I also did say was still standing up for myself and being quite firm on the fact that I wasn't just going to I apologize for things that I didn't need to and I don't need to invite her to everything, especially if she doesn't even like the people I'm with. We constantly were kind of battling over things and it just felt like it was not the fun times anymore. We were just arguing. That's kind of when I said, look, right now, how we're going backwards and forwards like this, we're just fighting so much. And she really didn't see it.

22:56Speaker 2:She was not as aware of it as me, whereas I was like, I do need a bit more of a break. And... Yeah, I just did try and kind of distance myself, but we were still making an effort. She did say at one point, I don't know why I'm so critical and harsh on you. And it is something I need to work on because I really just can't handle when you don't do things the way that I think you should. So she was making an effort to fix herself. She was going to her therapist again twice a week. So she was making active steps to work on herself. And she was making a real effort to be kind. and be nice and be thoughtful and like not, I guess, snap her tongue and be as honest kind of as she had been in the past.

23:42Speaker 1:It was, by her own admission, a genuine attempt to change and one the rest of the group could see too. So when the festive season rolled around, the group booked a campsite to ring in the new year. What could possibly go wrong?

23:55Speaker 2:Me and Jess were there A couple of days early, we road tripped down together and we had a really good time. It was like the old days. We were just laughing, singing, being silly, set up the campsite before all the other girls, Mia and all the other girls got there. And then the other girls came and she started with that more jealousy and saying that I was kind of leaving her out again. It came to New Year's Eve and the bathrooms were about, you know, 200 meters from when we were staying. She had already gone to the bathroom. And me and Mia walked down to the bathroom. When we went down to the bathroom, I yelled out, oh, Jess, are you in here? And she's like, yeah, I'm in here. And I said, oh, I'll just wait out the front for you. I walked out the front and waited for her while Mia started walking back up to the campsite. Then she came out of the bathroom and walked past me and I was like, hey, Jess, Jess, did you not see me? Jess. And she just kept walking up to the campsite. And I was like, okay.

24:54Speaker 2:I got up to the campsite. I was like, hey, did you not see me back there? She's like, of course I saw you. I saw that you just left me in the bathroom alone. Mind you, she went there alone. It's not a very scary place. We're at a caravan park.

25:06Speaker 1:That was the spark. What followed was the whole friendship's greatest hits delivered at volume.

25:11Speaker 2:And that's when she launched into leaving me out since the girls got here. We had quite a large argument. She was yelling at me and she said that I'm a show pony. And I was like, no, I'm an extrovert. So, of course, when other people are around, I do pick up on energy and I get more excited and I get more silly and like loud. And that's just who I am. That's who I always have been, though. And I don't know why you're bringing this up right now. That's who I am. And you've always known that. She brought up that I'm not good at replying to text messages and And of course, I then as well said, that's who I am. And I've never been someone that replies to text messages. So it's not like my behavior's changed.

25:49Speaker 2:So why are you bringing that up? So I started kind of defending myself and saying, these are my core personality traits that you're tearing down and bringing down. And that's who I am. So you're the one who fought for this friendship and said you wanted to still be friends. I don't know why. Like, tell me why you want to still be my friend, because right now you're just telling me everything that you don't like about me and that you don't want to do. So she really just said I was a bad friend. I also said to her, I don't think any friend is ever going to meet up to your expectations. I wasn't feeling all these things that I kind of had felt in the past. I think I was pretty okay with the things she was saying because I kind of was like, I know that's not me as a person.

26:30Speaker 1:Jess stormed off into the actual dark. and the group made a decision that at one time Chloe would have thought was unthinkable.

26:38Speaker 2:We went down to the beach for midnight because people were letting off fireworks and stuff and had our speaker and we're just being really silly and ridiculous. And I was really glad I was still able to kind of have a good time. I didn't let it ruin my night and still really had a good time with my friends. We weren't talking badly about her. We were just trying to have a really good time, which was lovely. After we'd been at the beach for the midnight camp and everything, we went back to the campsite and she was there.

27:05Speaker 2:She started getting angry again because one of the girls invited and said, do you want to come out for a drink? And she said, no, you guys didn't care about me when I walked off into the darkness. You left me so something bad could have happened and you just don't care and just started going off at them as well. That's when Mia butted in and said, I've seen the way that you treat Chloe and how you always are being rude to her, being awful, saying she's leaving you out. She always invites you. We always make you feel included. You know, if you don't, that's on you.

27:39Speaker 2:You've been a really bad friend to Chloe and really kind of called her out. That was hard because I didn't want to get anyone else involved and make it feel like we were ganging up on her. But at the same time, it was nice to kind of have that back up and know that I was not being crazy. I ended up sleeping in my car because I was like, I just, I don't even want to be in the same tent as her. I didn't sleep much. I actually went for a walk on the beach at like 4 a.m., which is quite interesting on New Year's Eve or New Year's Day, the different things I saw. But I actually saw heaps of dolphins and some manta rays, watched the sunrise.

28:10Speaker 2:And it was kind of like everyone else was asleep and it was kind of like a bit of me time to reflect on what just kind of happened. And it was really nice. And I felt quite good about that. The next day she said that she was getting picked up by one of her family members. I helped her pack up her tent but didn't really speak to her. Just like, you know, was like, oh, yeah, do you have that over there? Like, you know, it was very awkward kind of chit-chat. And then she got picked up and she came and said goodbye. I was at the pool because I kind of didn't want to be there when she got picked up.

28:39Speaker 1:It was only after she'd gone that Chloe found out what the neighbours had made of the whole thing.

28:44Speaker 2:Our people that were staying in the campsite next to us came up to me and said, were you the girl yelling or getting yelled at last night? And I said, I was getting yelled at. And he said... I just want to let you know that you handled it really well. And she was being really awful to you. And you just stood up for yourself in the most nice way. You weren't tearing her down, but you weren't taking it. And he was just this random little old man. I said, I'm so sorry if we kept you up. He said, no, it was great entertainment, you know, better than the wife snoring.

29:11Speaker 2:So he was really sweet. So it was also nice to kind of hear from a complete outsider that I wasn't being crazy and that I handled it really well. I think it was like in that moment when we were having that big fight, I was realizing the things that she was saying to me. It was kind of like a bit of a light bulb moment that I was like, so you just don't like me as a person because all of the things that you're saying about me, they're just my core personality traits. A couple of days after I got back from camping, I realized that I still had some of her stuff. So I had some of that she left behind when we were camping. So I actually just went and put it in her mailbox and the I sent her a message saying, hey, just letting you know that I have popped your stuff in your letterbox. And I'm just letting you know as well that I am going to block you on social media, not for any other reason than I just know that it'll be hard to see you living life and doing things.

30:08Speaker 2:And I just need a bit of a clean break. She came back and said, I think that's pretty ridiculous. After 10 years, that's all you've got to say. I said, I wish you nothing but the best. I have a lot more that I could say, but I just don't think it's worth bringing it up for us both. And I said, I'm too tired to argue with you anymore, but I wish her all the best.

30:25Speaker 1:Ten years of friendship, ending with not a scene, but a letterbox and a text message. The calm after the storm. They still shared a friendship group, so the odd run-in was inevitable, and Chloe decided she'd have to make her peace with that fairly quickly.

30:38Speaker 2:We did have mutual friends and I would see her at things and they were all, you know, kind and would check with me first and make sure I was okay with her being there. And I was okay with her being there. I really was. I was fine with seeing her. If anything, like, you know, it was nice because it would be a bit uncomfortable, but I was pretty okay with it all. Like I would see her at things. I would chat to her. I'd say hi. I never spoke badly about her to anyone and I didn't want anything bad for her. I think that obviously we weren't right as friends. We definitely weren't the right kind of friends for each other, but I hope that she learned from it. We did see each other around for probably about a year after and then I guess she kind of cut people off from that or they cut her off as well. I know that she has since done the same thing and I just have had not seen her in many years, many, many years.

31:29Speaker 1:So where does that leave Chloe now?

31:32Speaker 2:Soon after me and her stopped being friends, I ended up getting to the gym a lot and exercising heaps and I lost like 20 kilos and was doing all these great things for myself. I now know that I have ADHD and I got diagnosed about three years ago and it actually brought up a lot of stuff from that friendship breakdown when I was getting diagnosed with my psychiatrist. So it was quite emotional, but it helped me realize that she actually, even now, it really made me reconfirm that she didn't not like me she doesn't like people with ADHD I think like she can't handle those traits and she would find it lazy or that I was being lazy not replying to text messages now you know obviously we've come so far with mental health and stuff and we know that for me it is a lot harder and mentally challenging and everything for me to actually sit down and write back to a message is quite hard for me sometimes. So that's something that definitely came out during that a lot that I was like, oh, but it's hard as well because I really feel like I was there. I didn't always understand her anxiety and depression,

32:37Speaker 2:but I always really tried to understand and help. I guess with mine, it was a little bit more invisible that we didn't know that I had ADHD, but yeah. It was definitely a big thing when I got diagnosed a few years ago. Me and my partner, I guess, have spoken a lot about this relationship even though it was a friendship that I had. I think it's been probably one of the ones that have shaped me the most out of even partner relationships before. You know, we spoke about a lot of different things that his actual ex and her would do that are quite similar so it was quite a bit of a bonding experience for us as well that we kind of almost had the same situation just obviously his was a romantic and mine was a friendship but it's definitely been one of the things that have come up for me much more than any romantic relationships that I've had before. I think that it was a harder kind of breakup than any relationship I've had. It changed my life more than anything and made me the person I am today more than anything as well. I'm a lot better at sticking up for myself now and having hard conversations. I think she definitely

33:44Speaker 2:taught me how to have really hard conversations with people because I actually used to kind of avoid that. I definitely do miss her, the fun, amazing times and laughing that we had together. Like I definitely do miss that. I also, though, don't miss the bad side. And I think the bad outweighs the good. I have absolutely like no drama in my life now. And I'm just the happiest I've ever been. You know, I've got the best partner. I've got the best friends. And I also think, though, that I'm really glad that it all happened because it made me choose myself and stand up for myself a little bit more. And now I'm way better at doing that.

34:19Speaker 2:And I'm also very careful the way I'm doing it, not doing it too harshly because I learned a lot of lessons from this. I just really appreciate it for what it was and really just value that time that we did have together.

34:46Speaker 1:Everyone Has an Ex-Best Friend is a Minty Media production and proudly part of the Mamma Mia Network. This interview was conducted, written and produced by Linda Scott and narrated by me, Georgia Love. If you have a story you'd like to share, email everyonehasanx at mintymedia.com.au. You can support us by following the show in your favourite podcast app, sharing it with a friend and leaving us a five-star review.